| 00:37 | <astearns> | AryehGregor: I decided to look at the "CSS points are 1/72 of an actual inch when printed" claim in Mac browsers |
| 00:37 | <astearns> | AryehGregor: it's true for FireFox 7 |
| 00:37 | <astearns> | AryehGregor: Safari prints slightly larger |
| 00:37 | <astearns> | AryehGregor: Opera prints slightly smaller |
| 00:37 | <astearns> | AryehGregor: Chrome doesn't even try - it seems to print at the screen zoom level |
| 01:04 | <Hixie> | ok seriously, why can't people read specs |
| 01:04 | <Hixie> | almost whenever someone has a complaint about a spec, they end up quoting a non-normative note or example |
| 01:05 | <Hixie> | !@#$%^&*~( it's NOT NORMATIVE |
| 01:05 | <Hixie> | CANNOT BE USED TO BACK UP AN ARGUMENT ABOUT WHAT THE SPEC SAYS |
| 01:05 | <Hixie> | sigh |
| 01:05 | <mkanat> | Maybe they don't know what "normative" means? |
| 01:07 | <Dashiva> | No, it happens with examples too |
| 01:07 | <Dashiva> | "This example shows X, so Y must therefore be invalid" |
| 01:12 | <mkanat> | Well, the world has no shortage of stupid people. |
| 01:12 | <mkanat> | We're not in a stupid-people conservation crisis. |
| 01:12 | <mkanat> | They're not an endangered species. |
| 01:13 | <Dashiva> | They certainly are, that's why we have warning labels everywhere |
| 01:17 | <Hixie> | it's not even only stupid people |
| 01:17 | <Hixie> | people who are otherwise highly competent are susceptible to this just as much |
| 02:03 | <TabAtkins> | Dammit, now I've started writing IDL and I suspect I'm going to be angry at it. |
| 06:45 | <annevk> | so because of W3C publication politics we're getting an initTouchEvent method that will be obsolete any day now? http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-webevents/2011JulSep/0092.html |
| 06:45 | <annevk> | :( |
| 08:07 | <hsivonen> | http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2011Sep/0088.html |
| 08:07 | <hsivonen> | "I will reiterate (for the nth time) that it would be valuable for the |
| 08:07 | <hsivonen> | W3C to specify what a "browser" is," |
| 08:07 | <hsivonen> | that would be interesting to watch |
| 08:08 | <hsivonen> | esp. when the last sentence of that paragraph seems to want to define Silk as "not a browser" |
| 08:28 | <annevk> | mnot also seems to want to turn it into some kind of ISO thing, with certification and what not |
| 08:28 | <annevk> | that does not strike me as a good idea |
| 12:09 | <yuno_> | is colgroup/col good for anything other than setting the width of columns? |
| 12:09 | <yuno_> | using them for alignment doesnt seem to work if i add some class and use some css. the deprecated align attribute also doesnt do anything |
| 12:11 | <yuno_> | i mean, nth-child is nice and all, but i kinda need something i can use today. is the only option to add a class to every cell? |
| 12:12 | <yuno_> | (i already did read the current specs, the old specs, mdn, and i also googled around for a bit) |
| 12:48 | <hsivonen> | I pull from hg, start merging code and end up writing an email like this http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-webapps/2011JulSep/1747.html |
| 12:56 | <annevk> | maybe for chunked we can force UTF-8? |
| 12:57 | <annevk> | not even look at anything else |
| 13:00 | <annevk> | so instead of WebSQL with SQLite we will now have IndexedDB with LevelDB? |
| 13:44 | <hsivonen> | what's LevelDB? |
| 13:51 | <beverloo> | annevk, LevelDB is just the back-end we chose to implement IndexedDB on |
| 13:51 | <beverloo> | incognito mode still uses SQLite for it |
| 13:52 | <beverloo> | hsivonen, http://code.google.com/p/leveldb/, a fast key-value storage library |
| 14:19 | <annevk5> | where is ms2ger? |
| 14:20 | <annevk5> | did anyone have a look at the new exception model? |
| 14:20 | <annevk5> | I wonder if I should roll it out in DOM4 and file some bugs on browsers |
| 14:53 | <annevk5> | I guess heycam needs to be here |
| 15:07 | <espressive_> | hey everyone |
| 15:07 | <espressive_> | Quick question, would an element with rel="help" and a title="Help text" make sense as a JavaScript hook for tooltips? Does not match the usage as described by the WHAT-WG (http://developers.whatwg.org/links.html#link-type-help) exactly, but close enough? |
| 16:10 | <annevk5> | Is http://wiki.whatwg.org/wiki/User_talk:Paolorte spam? |
| 16:34 | <dglazkov> | good morning, Whatwg! |
| 16:35 | <annevk5> | good morning dglazkov! |
| 16:38 | myakura | is about to say good night |
| 16:38 | <dglazkov> | annevk5: :D let me guess: you've suffixed yourself with 5 in honor of HTML5? |
| 16:38 | <dglazkov5> | hrm. |
| 16:39 | <dglazkov5> | mine looks more like jackson 5 |
| 16:40 | <myakura> | wait!? are you guys moving back to a versioned model!? |
| 16:40 | <divya> | hahahahh |
| 16:40 | <dglazkov> | myakura: no, only for people. |
| 16:40 | <divya> | so wait if 5 of you suffix yourself with 5 |
| 16:40 | <divya> | you would be the "html" 5 |
| 16:41 | <dglazkov> | that sounds like something from tabloid headlines. |
| 16:41 | <dglazkov> | "the infamous html 5 is running amok, terrifying upstanding citizens" |
| 16:42 | <divya> | "html5 wrecks homes and destroys marriages! Mayor screams for immediate imprisonment!"… |
| 16:42 | <hasather5> | sounds fun, I'm in |
| 16:42 | <divya> | hahahahahh |
| 16:42 | <divya> | hi5 hasather5 |
| 16:42 | <hasather5> | hi divya |
| 16:43 | <divya> | :) |
| 16:50 | <annevk5> | help |
| 16:50 | <annevk5> | anarchy on the IRC channel |
| 16:50 | <divya> | you started it. |
| 16:50 | <dglazkov> | annevk5: works as intended. |
| 16:50 | <divya> | hahahah |
| 16:53 | <annevk5> | http://blog.whatwg.org/weekly-xbl-observers |
| 16:53 | <annevk5> | (the URL is a "joke") |
| 16:54 | <dglazkov> | annevk5: :) |
| 17:16 | <annevk5> | I moved previous/next links down |
| 17:16 | <annevk5> | on the blog |
| 17:16 | <annevk5> | if anyone has other improvements let me know |
| 17:34 | <annevk5> | oh yes |
| 17:34 | <annevk5> | my first W3C Recommendation |
| 17:34 | <annevk5> | it's on namespaces |
| 17:35 | <annevk5> | in CSS |
| 17:35 | <annevk5> | there's a lot of jokes there |
| 17:35 | <divya> | sgtm annevk5 |
| 17:36 | <annevk5> | proof: http://www.w3.org/TR/css3-namespace/ |
| 17:36 | <divya> | is this the shortest css spec ever? |
| 17:36 | <annevk5> | did I beat Hixie to it? |
| 17:36 | <annevk5> | oh CSS 2.1 was first |
| 17:39 | <erlehmann> | CSS 2.1 shot first. |
| 17:43 | <GlitchMr> | What actually @namespace does... |
| 17:44 | <GlitchMr> | oh, i see |
| 17:44 | <erlehmann> | annevk5, usability comment: if prev/next links are at top, they do not change position. |
| 17:44 | <erlehmann> | you can quickly click through articles then |
| 17:44 | <erlehmann> | at bottom, less useful |
| 17:47 | <annevk5> | hmm yeah |
| 17:47 | <annevk5> | but if you are not reading, you're just wasting our bandwidth |
| 17:47 | <divya> | hahahah |
| 21:01 | <dglazkov> | PSA: going on vacation until Oct 10 in 3 hours. Will attempt to stay offline. Wish me luck. |
| 21:07 | <gsnedders> | dglazkov: Good luck. |
| 22:07 | <Hixie> | document.alinkColor isn't specced |
| 22:07 | <Hixie> | did i overlook it or do we not need it? |
| 22:07 | <Hixie> | looks like at least firefox doesn't support it |
| 22:08 | <Hixie> | oh no nevermind |
| 22:08 | <Hixie> | it does |
| 22:08 | <Hixie> | i typoed it |
| 22:08 | <annevk> | all browsers have it |
| 22:08 | <annevk> | Opera / Firefox / Safari |
| 22:08 | <Hixie> | and IE |
| 22:08 | <Hixie> | k |
| 22:08 | <Hixie> | i guess i'll spec it! |
| 22:09 | <annevk> | funny how nobody notices |
| 22:09 | <Hixie> | oh wait i did spec it |
| 22:09 | <Hixie> | i was searching for the wrong capitalisation |
| 22:09 | <Hixie> | ok |
| 22:09 | <Hixie> | all is well with the world |
| 22:10 | <annevk> | we should really have some kind of special IDL type for event handlers |
| 22:11 | <annevk> | this current syntax sucks for something that is used all over |
| 22:11 | <Hixie> | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aSVpBqOsC7o |
| 22:11 | <Hixie> | er, wrong channel! |
| 23:38 | <hober> | Hixie: in #pixel-manipulation, this text is unfortunately in an example and not in the main prose: "The data returned by getImageData () is at the resolution of the canvas backing store, which is likely to not be one device pixel to each CSS pixel if the display used is a high resolution display." |
| 23:39 | <danbeam> | dbaron: question about css3-transitions - if I add two classes in quick succession to an element, and one class adds a -webkit-transition: -webkit-transform 1s; and the other adds -webkit-transform: scale(2); (for example), what should happen? |
| 23:40 | <hober> | danbeam: if you added the classes in that order, the transition should apply |
| 23:45 | <danbeam> | hober: that was my thinking as well, however I'm having to wait til the next JS/UI turn by scheduling a setTimeout to add the trans*form* class (on some platforms) |
| 23:46 | <danbeam> | I think this is an implementation difference, not specified behavior, though (like as you said, it *should* work) |
| 23:48 | <hober> | oh, i see. yeah, it makes sense that you could see both behaviors |
| 23:48 | <hober> | and either behavior is justifiable |
| 23:49 | <danbeam> | because style updates aren't guaranteed to be instant for performance benefits? |
| 23:49 | <danbeam> | s/instant/sync/ |
| 23:49 | <hober> | more or less |
| 23:50 | <danbeam> | I may try a .innerText access or a getComputedStyle() and see if this ensures things are flushed synchronously |
| 23:50 | <divya> | danbeam: afaik all browsers repaint at one go |
| 23:51 | <divya> | which is why you wont see changes unless you setTimeout |
| 23:51 | <danbeam> | divya: it's strange, Chromium for Linux and (it seems) OSX work fine in this regard, but on Windows it doesn't work unless I schedule a class addition later |
| 23:52 | <divya> | really? when I tested you had to do setTimeout |
| 23:52 | <danbeam> | anyways, I just wanted to see if it was specified or not (like I said) |
| 23:52 | <divya> | if you are changing immediately |
| 23:52 | <divya> | e.g. addClass("blur"); removeclass("blur"); |
| 23:53 | <danbeam> | divya: http://jsfiddle.net/X6EFX/ works for me on OSX, Chrome 14 |
| 23:53 | danbeam | inb4 "Y U NO Opera?" |
| 23:54 | <danbeam> | (sorry, just checking on Chrome for right now) |
| 23:55 | <divya> | danbeam: err thats not the case i referred to |
| 23:55 | <divya> | the case is when you add/remove classnames and expect it to trigger a transition |
| 23:57 | <danbeam> | divya: PM |
| 23:58 | <divya> | k |