| 09:23 | <zcorpan> | annevk-cloud: "If url's relative flag is set, set encoding override to utf-8." http://url.spec.whatwg.org/#query-state |
| 09:23 | <zcorpan> | annevk-cloud: isn't that backwards? or am i misreading it? |
| 09:24 | <zcorpan> | annevk-cloud: i read that encoding override gets set to utf-8 for urls with relative schemes |
| 09:28 | <zcorpan> | annevk-cloud: also, should ws/wss not always use utf-8? not that they're useful in <a href> but still |
| 09:31 | <SteveF> | arunranga: FWIW moves afoot to have editors drafts at /TR http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/spec-prod/2014JanMar/thread.html |
| 10:49 | <annevk> | Is WHATWG down? |
| 10:50 | <annevk> | Hmm just slow |
| 11:04 | <annevk> | Was there no Gecko bug for https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=24005 ? |
| 11:09 | <zcorpan_> | annevk: added tests https://critic.hoppipolla.co.uk/showcommit?first=c94f486e&last=70f343af&review=437 |
| 11:10 | <wefo> | Hmm. |
| 11:10 | <wefo> | Can somebody please confirm with me that line 1 loads the font "whenever it feels like it", and line 2 loads the font "right now, before loading anything else"? http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=7m8LnWeK |
| 11:10 | <annevk> | zcorpan_: I can do the utf-8 thing for ws/wss |
| 11:11 | <wefo> | That is, somebody who knows this stuff. |
| 11:11 | <annevk> | zcorpan_: your bug report seems accurate |
| 11:11 | <zcorpan_> | annevk: ok |
| 11:12 | <annevk> | wefo: the second line uses an invalid data URL; it won't get you anywhere |
| 11:12 | <wefo> | Yeah, I just noticed. |
| 11:12 | <wefo> | Because it breaks on my computer. |
| 11:12 | <wefo> | annevk: I was told to use the latter. |
| 11:12 | <annevk> | wefo: there's no guarantees on when a data URL is interpreted and applied to a page with respect to fonts at the moment |
| 11:12 | <wefo> | Because it supposedly works "block-mode". |
| 11:12 | <wefo> | So then that guy was lying. |
| 11:13 | <wefo> | I will have to do the insane hack after all. |
| 11:13 | <annevk> | wefo: well if you include the entire font inline it's reasonable to assume it'll apply faster |
| 11:13 | <wefo> | Include the entire font inline? |
| 11:13 | <annevk> | wefo: since the font will download together with the style sheet, but you need to know how to use data URLs |
| 11:13 | <wefo> | Oh... is that the direct data stuff in base64 or something? |
| 11:14 | <wefo> | I was going to use this insane hack to determine if the user indeed has the font loaded: http://www.kirupa.com/html5/detect_whether_font_is_installed.htm |
| 11:15 | <wefo> | Frankly, it's kind of ingenious. |
| 11:15 | <wefo> | I like it when things like that "work", even if they are not ideal. |
| 11:23 | <jgraham_> | annevk: I nominate you to do that code review btw |
| 11:24 | <annevk> | jgraham: zcorpan_: done |
| 11:25 | <annevk> | Oh I see there is a bunch more... |
| 11:25 | <jgraham> | Heh |
| 11:25 | <annevk> | jgraham: so this move: https://critic.hoppipolla.co.uk/57951ecc?review=437 |
| 11:25 | <annevk> | jgraham: that should just be fine no? |
| 11:26 | <annevk> | jgraham: you already reviewed a bunch |
| 11:27 | <jgraham> | annevk: I reviewed all the trivial bits |
| 11:27 | <jgraham> | Basically all the hard stuff is the .js file |
| 11:28 | <annevk> | Can you give me a review link for that file? |
| 11:29 | <annevk> | I have the feeling I keep looking at individual commits |
| 11:30 | <jgraham> | https://critic.hoppipolla.co.uk/showcommit?review=437&filter=pending |
| 11:31 | <zcorpan_> | annevk: you can drag-and-drop in the commit list to get a squashed review |
| 11:31 | <jgraham> | Yeah, or use the filter links just above it |
| 11:34 | <annevk> | Ah great |
| 11:34 | <annevk> | So this looks okay to me... I take it you have run it all? |
| 11:35 | <annevk> | My only nit is using a string rather than array... |
| 11:36 | <annevk> | I guess you didn't want to type all the quotes or something? |
| 11:37 | <zcorpan_> | yeah |
| 11:39 | <zcorpan_> | i've run it, yes. but some browser bugs cause some tests to time out, so it's not awesome |
| 11:39 | <zcorpan_> | also search for XXX |
| 11:41 | <jgraham> | zcorpan_: If some tests time out that's probably OK as long as the other tests still run |
| 11:41 | <zcorpan_> | ok, yeah they do |
| 11:42 | <jgraham> | I can live with that. We can always improve it in followup commits if there's something that causes problems |
| 11:53 | jgraham | assumes annevk didn't *really* care about the array thing |
| 11:54 | <jgraham> | zcorpan_: Worth squashing before pushing or should I just merge? |
| 11:54 | <annevk> | I'd like to hear some reasoning |
| 11:55 | <annevk> | But I'm not going to block on it :-) |
| 11:55 | <zcorpan_> | i commented in critic |
| 11:55 | <zcorpan_> | jgraham: no opinion |
| 11:56 | <jgraham> | Let's just merge |
| 11:57 | <jgraham> | Done |
| 11:57 | <jgraham> | zcorpan_, annevk: Thanks |
| 11:57 | <zcorpan_> | thank you! |
| 12:18 | <MikeSmith> | annevk: http://krijnhoetmer.nl/irc-logs/whatwg/20140115#l-803 |
| 12:22 | <hsivonen> | what make people post to Usenet using DOS encodings? |
| 12:27 | <hsivonen> | *makes |
| 12:29 | <MikeSmith> | fashion statement |
| 12:30 | <icaaq> | hi, here they use the label element http://filamentgroup.com/lab/bulletproof_icon_fonts/ to "label" som text. is that really semantically correct? |
| 12:34 | <hsivonen> | "Windows codepage 1252, the codepage commonly used for English and other Western European languages, was based on an American National Standards Institute (ANSI) draft. That draft eventually became ISO 8859-1, but Windows codepage 1252 was implemented before the standard became final, and is not exactly the same as ISO 8859-1." |
| 12:34 | <hsivonen> | http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/ee719641.aspx |
| 12:34 | <hsivonen> | so windows-1252 even existed first! |
| 12:34 | <Ms2ger> | Sounds like the box model in old-IE |
| 13:10 | <annevk> | hsivonen: man, the more I hear about ISO and encodings, ... |
| 13:11 | <annevk> | MikeSmith: interesting suggestion :-) |
| 13:29 | <annevk> | MikeSmith: that doesn't quite work for suggesting what it is |
| 13:31 | <MikeSmith> | annevk: maybe it's not necessary to suggest what it is. In the end it's just an opaque string, right? |
| 13:32 | <annevk> | It's an opaque string, most typically used as part of the DNS or as a local network address. |
| 13:32 | <annevk> | Maybe something like that could work, if I can find good references for both. |
| 13:45 | <zcorpan> | Hixie: http://www.w3.org/html/wg/drafts/html/master/embedded-content-0.html#text-tracks-exposing-in-band-metadata doesn't seem to exist in whatwg html |
| 13:47 | <zcorpan> | Hixie: what's the deal? |
| 13:48 | <MikeSmith> | annevk: A domain label is either an IN-ADDR.ARPA suffix or an opaque string that represents one octet of an Internet address. |
| 13:49 | <MikeSmith> | hmm what does that even mean |
| 13:49 | <Ms2ger`> | How about IPv6? |
| 13:50 | <annevk> | Ms2ger`: well we know that's not a domain label :-) |
| 13:51 | <zcorpan> | a domain label is an extremity of Jesus |
| 13:51 | <MikeSmith> | heh |
| 13:51 | <annevk> | "The text attribute, on getting, must return UTF-16 text converted from data of the text track cue that the TextTrackCue object represents." more like what's the deal with that text |
| 13:52 | <Ms2ger`> | No ip6.arpa? |
| 14:12 | <zcorpan> | w3c-test.org doesn't use wpt-serve yet? |
| 14:13 | <jgraham> | MikeSmith was working on it |
| 14:14 | <MikeSmith> | still "working" on it yeah |
| 14:15 | <MikeSmith> | meaning, procrastinating |
| 14:16 | <MikeSmith> | if only the CSS WG didn't exist, things would all be much simpler |
| 14:35 | <zcorpan> | not sure how i got here but it was a bit funny http://9gag.com/gag/agyOxmx |
| 14:39 | <wefo> | zcorpan: "These are Satan. Bears." |
| 14:41 | <annevk> | GitHub down? |
| 14:52 | <mathiasbynens> | annevk: WFM |
| 15:12 | <annevk> | mathiasbynens: ta |
| 16:01 | <annevk> | IBM emailed the WHATWG list. Can someone confirm hell froze over? |
| 16:02 | <jgraham> | Can't verify, too busy dodging flying pigs |
| 16:12 | GPHemsley | is in cold Georgia. Does that count? |
| 16:39 | <wefo> | Wait... there is a textAlign property to contexts? So all those hours of measuring the width and doing complex math calculations to get it centered were wasted? |
| 16:39 | <wefo> | Is this some kind of bleeding edge feature? I hate never being able to tell. There is no clear documentation whatsoever. |
| 16:57 | <dglazkov> | good morning, Whatwg! |
| 17:06 | <Hixie> | zcorpan: DataCue doesn't make sense. If you don't know the format, how can you expose it? If you do know the format, then use the interface that that format provides. |
| 17:32 | <MikeSmith> | CORS is Recommendation |
| 17:32 | <MikeSmith> | now all the confused deputy attacks can begin in earnest |
| 17:32 | Ms2ger` | confuses MikeSmith |
| 17:33 | <MikeSmith> | ... |
| 17:33 | <Hixie> | isn't CORS obsolete? i thought Fetch replaced it a while back. |
| 17:34 | <MikeSmith> | Hixie: well yeah |
| 17:35 | <MikeSmith> | it has joined the ranks of the undead |
| 17:35 | <Hixie> | wait is that the one anne was telling me about where they decided to just ignore all the open bugs? |
| 17:36 | <MikeSmith> | bingo |
| 17:36 | <MikeSmith> | they "resolved" them though |
| 17:36 | <MikeSmith> | which is technically different from ignoring them |
| 17:37 | <Hixie> | iirc they ignored them for 2 years then resolved them as not relevant since nobody had looked at them in two years |
| 17:37 | <MikeSmith> | that would be one way to describe it, yes |
| 17:37 | <MikeSmith> | the accurate way |
| 17:37 | <Hixie> | which is some bug system ninja juju that i have to say is pretty impressive |
| 17:38 | <MikeSmith> | hey this is what we WGs for man |
| 17:38 | <MikeSmith> | that kind of magic |
| 17:39 | <jgraham> | Wait what? MikeSmith is a deputy? |
| 17:39 | <Hixie> | i wish there were journalists who cared about this kind of crap enough to report on it |
| 17:39 | <jgraham> | So who's the sheriff in this town? |
| 17:40 | <jgraham> | Isn't that a trick they learnt from the chrome bugtracker? |
| 17:40 | <Hixie> | i mean, this is just as messed up as some political shenanigans, and has similar long-term effects (which is to say, mostly none) |
| 17:40 | <jgraham> | Well it's mildly more interesting than who the president of France is sleeping with, but I'm not sure why that's being reported either |
| 17:42 | <MikeSmith> | yeah it's like politics but robbed of all the debauchery |
| 17:42 | <MikeSmith> | which just makes it depressing instead of scandalous |
| 17:42 | <jgraham> | Anyway, if EME has taught you nothing else it should have been that getting press attention only leads to a bunch of people with extremely shallow understanding of the issues getting rilled up in an entirely impotent way |
| 17:42 | <MikeSmith> | jgraham: but, freedom! |
| 17:44 | <Hixie> | jgraham: at least it'd make me feel like i wasn't alone in thinking it was ridiculous :-) |
| 17:44 | <Domenic_> | "Congratulations Anne on today's publication of the CORS Recommendation!" hmmmm |
| 17:44 | <MikeSmith> | jgraham seems to not understand about the Wisdom of the Crowds |
| 17:46 | <jgraham> | I only think it's ridiculous if you are measuing against The Process. If you think a Process where things go to Rec. irrespective of bugs, and then are worked on further, is better then CORS is doing all the right things. Now W3C probably don't realise that, but perhaps they will cotton on one of these decades |
| 17:46 | <jgraham> | (actually closing the bugs is nonsense of course) |
| 17:48 | <arunranga> | I think we should add text that refers to CORS as a snapshot subset of Fetch. |
| 17:48 | <Hixie> | jgraham: what i find ridiculous is the hypocrisy of claiming to care about a process and then _blatently_ not caring about it |
| 17:50 | <MikeSmith> | well they are standing on the shoulders of some giants, as far as that pattern goes |
| 17:51 | <MikeSmith> | well maybe not giants |
| 17:52 | <Hixie> | i really don't understand why anyone would claim to believe in one set of principles, but act in a way contrary to them. i really don't see the point. why lie about your values? or if it's not a lie, why not do a good job of actually meeting them? |
| 17:52 | <Hixie> | i just don't get it |
| 17:52 | <jgraham> | Because they don't see it as a moral problem |
| 17:53 | <jgraham> | It's a simple path-finding exercise. "I need to achieve X. Constraints Y exist. How can I get to X as fast as possible given Y" |
| 17:54 | <Hixie> | ok but then why claim that one is trying to achieve Z? |
| 17:54 | <jgraham> | The only confusion is the fact that the *stated* Y and the reality of Y are quite different |
| 17:54 | <Hixie> | right, that's what i'm saying |
| 17:54 | <Hixie> | why not state the truth? |
| 17:54 | <jgraham> | Well see it from the point of view of the W3C |
| 17:55 | <Hixie> | i don't understand the point of view of the W3C, that's my problem |
| 17:56 | <Domenic_> | It seems like there are pretty obvious gains, in general, from stating a position of one thing and then doing another thing |
| 17:56 | <Domenic_> | That shouldn't be hard to understand |
| 17:56 | <jgraham> | If they rigrously enforced all the stated Y, it would take forever to get anything done and people would do work elsewhere. But part of Y is that changing the stated Y is very difficult, so instead they make up Y' which is Y with a whole load of concessions to the people actually trying to do X" |
| 17:56 | <Hixie> | Domenic_: what are the gains here? |
| 17:57 | <Hixie> | jgraham: nothing is "very difficult" |
| 18:07 | <jgraham> | I mean the W3C can only really cause limited damage. It can annoy you and cause the rest of us to have to point everyone we know to whatwg specs |
| 18:08 | <Hixie> | i'm not making any judgements as to absolute objective harm :-) |
| 18:09 | <jgraham> | OK, well I guess it's pretty normal that your personal sense of disappointment isn't correlated with objective harm |
| 18:10 | <Hixie> | btw, i would appreciate a review of https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=23475#c16 from people here |
| 18:11 | <Hixie> | it's a proposal for revamping how focus works |
| 18:11 | <Hixie> | (new proposal from yesterday with more readable terms and more web compatability) |
| 18:12 | <Hixie> | it handles, amongst other things, scrollable regions (long ignored by specs) and <dialog>s (new) |
| 18:24 | <Hixie> | on a different note... i wonder where to spec that the 'select' event fires sometimes |
| 18:26 | <Hixie> | (in response to user interaction, i mean) |
| 18:28 | <annevk> | I have another REC... |
| 18:29 | <annevk> | css3-namespace and cors |
| 18:29 | <annevk> | And I'm not a big fan of either |
| 18:35 | <Hixie> | annevk: http://w3cmemes.tumblr.com/post/73529051245 :-P |
| 18:36 | <annevk> | Hixie: no wonder I act out like in http://w3cmemes.tumblr.com/post/73519371870/anne-van-kesteren-ladies-and-gentlemen-csswgs |
| 18:38 | <Hixie> | annevk: :-P |
| 18:42 | <aklein> | annevk: hi there, still about? |
| 18:42 | <annevk> | aklein: if it's quick |
| 18:42 | <annevk> | aklein: I'll be in SF starting Monday 4/5PM |
| 18:43 | <annevk> | aklein: until the 31st |
| 18:43 | <aklein> | annevk: another time, then, I was just curious if you think there's anything else to be done about ShadowRoot.baseURI without isolation |
| 18:43 | <aklein> | annevk: ah, cool, we should meet up at some point |
| 18:43 | <annevk> | aklein: after you brought up your point I wasn't so sure anymore what the point would be |
| 18:44 | <aklein> | annevk: yeah, that was my thought, just wondering if there were things I hadn't thought of |
| 18:44 | <annevk> | aklein: in the declarative scenario it might work better |
| 18:44 | <aklein> | the good news is that without <element> being specced, folks have to do something to set up their ShadowRoot anyway so they can fix their URLs by hand for now |
| 18:44 | <aklein> | sounds like we're on the same page |
| 18:44 | <annevk> | aklein: right |
| 18:45 | <annevk> | aklein: I'm still interested in defining baseURI though, potentially removing most of the cruft for now then |
| 18:46 | <aklein> | annevk: indeed, the current HTML definition of baseURLs is...not good |
| 18:47 | <aklein> | especially since Gecko actually fully supports xml:base |
| 18:47 | <aklein> | anyway, I'll let you go for now and catch up later |
| 18:48 | <Hixie> | wait what? |
| 18:48 | <Hixie> | what's wrong with the HTML definition? |
| 18:48 | <Hixie> | HTML supports xml:base |
| 18:48 | <annevk> | We don't want to support xml:base :-) |
| 18:49 | <aklein> | Hixie: neither Blink nor WebKit support xml:base in HTML documents |
| 18:49 | <Hixie> | i'm not following the problem here |
| 18:49 | <aklein> | or rather, they appear to support it (Node.baseURI is affected by it) but don't (URL completion/loading is unaffected) |
| 18:50 | <annevk> | Hixie: it's not really a problem, it's an opportunity to massively simplify base URL handling |
| 18:50 | <Hixie> | ah so by "the current HTML definition of baseURLs is...not good" you mean you want to change it, not that it's buggy |
| 18:50 | <aklein> | and avoid tree-walking to do URL handling |
| 18:50 | <Hixie> | ok |
| 18:50 | <Ms2ger`> | That would be nice |
| 18:50 | <Hixie> | i'm fine with dropping xml:base, though xml:base does make web components work better |
| 18:50 | <aklein> | Hixie: sorry, there are bugs, xml:base is not the bug |
| 18:51 | <Hixie> | we'll need something if we don't have xml:base |
| 18:51 | <Hixie> | oh |
| 18:51 | <Hixie> | what are the bugs? |
| 18:51 | <aklein> | Hixie: I've been meaning to file one about <img> |
| 18:51 | <Hixie> | Ms2ger`: ping https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=24238 |
| 18:51 | <aklein> | it reloads when affected by a base URL change |
| 18:51 | <Ms2ger`> | Oh dear |
| 18:51 | <Hixie> | aklein: it does? wow |
| 18:52 | <aklein> | Hixie: in Webkit/Blink/Gecko at least. really need to try some IEs. |
| 18:52 | <Hixie> | aklein: i intentionally made the spec not reload images in that case |
| 18:52 | <Hixie> | aklein: it would cause all kinds of hassle with pushState(), e.g. |
| 18:52 | <Ms2ger`> | Hixie, no strong opinion here |
| 18:52 | <Hixie> | Ms2ger`: should i wontfix then? |
| 18:52 | <Ms2ger`> | Hixie, if you prefer not-resolving, that's fine with me |
| 18:52 | <aklein> | Hixie: only sometimes |
| 18:52 | <aklein> | Hixie: when <img> switches documents it reloads |
| 18:52 | Ms2ger` | isn't sure ping will happen anyway |
| 18:52 | <aklein> | not necessarily on pushState |
| 18:52 | <Hixie> | aklein: oh when it switches documents, ok. that's easy to believe. |
| 18:53 | <Hixie> | aklein: that's not when changing base URL, that's when changing documents. |
| 18:53 | <aklein> | Hixie: speaking of web components, agreed that it would be nice to have something. that's what I was talking to annevk about above, see https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=20976#c24 |
| 18:53 | <aklein> | is there some changing documents hook in HTML I've missed? |
| 18:54 | <aklein> | Hixie: err, https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=20976#c20 is probably a better starting point, that was esprehn's last suggestion |
| 18:55 | <Hixie> | aklein: the html spec doesn't currently reload images crossing documents, no. please do file that http://whatwg.org/newbug |
| 18:57 | <Hixie> | aklein: the scripts in these comments are expected to be running where? in the context of a component? |
| 18:58 | <Hixie> | aklein: i guess web components' documents aren't "live" documents, so they don't run script? |
| 18:58 | <Hixie> | aklein: what's the global scope of a script in a component? |
| 19:03 | <aklein> | Hixie: when you say "component" I think you may be combining two concepts, "imports" and "custom elements" |
| 19:03 | <aklein> | I realize that those were historically more intertwined :) |
| 19:03 | <Hixie> | i've no idea what either of those are, but ok |
| 19:03 | <Hixie> | i just mean whatever it is that you use to create proprietary widgets using DOM and JS |
| 19:03 | <aklein> | I'd say that in your terms, the script in a component runs in the global scope of the hosting page |
| 19:03 | <Hixie> | wow |
| 19:03 | <Hixie> | ok |
| 19:03 | <Hixie> | yeah, that'll give you all kinds of issues |
| 19:04 | <aklein> | indeed |
| 19:04 | <Hixie> | why not the xbl approach of running the scripts in the binding document? |
| 19:04 | <aklein> | I'd have to go look up xbl to answer that question well, dglazkov might have a better answer |
| 19:04 | <aklein> | the short answer is there is no other global at present |
| 19:04 | <aklein> | that is, none of the current web components specs involve additional global scopes |
| 19:04 | <Hixie> | right, but why not? |
| 19:05 | <aklein> | though they do involve additional documents |
| 19:05 | <Hixie> | seems like you'd want a global scope per resource defining widgets |
| 19:06 | <aklein> | Hixie: there's a public-webapps thread about this somewhere |
| 19:06 | <aklein> | http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-webapps/2013OctDec/0483.html |
| 19:06 | <aklein> | not sure there are actual answers there |
| 19:06 | <aklein> | but there's discussion |
| 19:07 | <Hixie> | well that e-mail pretty much summarises my concern, yes :-) |
| 19:08 | <Hixie> | looks like dglazkov's answer is that you can have a new scope using modules, or something |
| 19:08 | <Hixie> | so that it works even within just one doc |
| 19:08 | <Hixie> | which makes sense i guess |
| 19:08 | <Hixie> | but in that case, the problem you had earlier is easy |
| 19:09 | <Hixie> | you just make the modules be where you put the base URL scopes |
| 19:09 | <Hixie> | (presumably modules hook into the script settings object mechanism) |
| 19:20 | <Hixie> | man, i hate it when headless computers start acting up and need rebooting |
| 19:20 | <Hixie> | such a pain |
| 21:03 | <TabAtkins> | annevk-cloud: What are your thoughts on fetch()? Do you have sufficiently organized thoughts to write something down I can put into a spec? Maybe talk about this next week when you're here for ServiceWorker stuff? |
| 21:42 | <Hixie> | so... why does inserting an audio element into another document do something to whether the audio is playing or not? |
| 21:45 | <jgraham> | A better question might be "why do we have a model where moving things between documents isn't just a deep clone?" |
| 21:45 | <jgraham> | To which the answer is probably "legacy" |
| 21:45 | <jgraham> | So I think my answer to your question is "see /topic" |
| 21:47 | <Hixie> | why would moving things between docs be anything interesting at all? |
| 21:47 | <Hixie> | i don't understand what's going on here |
| 21:48 | <Hixie> | however, firefox's inability to play my test audio isn't helping |
| 21:48 | <Hixie> | what formats does firefox support? |
| 21:49 | <Hixie> | i've tried ogg, wave, and mp3 |
| 21:50 | <Hixie> | oh ffs, it's mime types |
| 21:51 | <Hixie> | i hate mime types so much |
| 21:51 | <jgraham> | Hixie: Moving elements between documents is quite problematic in general because of the prototype chain |
| 21:51 | <Hixie> | so pointless |
| 21:51 | <Hixie> | jgraham: yeah the problem there is that we have this crazy idea of mutable prototypes and per-page prototypes |
| 21:51 | <Hixie> | ok, with the mime type set, wave works. ok. |
| 21:53 | <aklein> | Hixie: thanks for doing the experimentation, apologies for my laziness |
| 21:53 | <aklein> | the other one I've been wrestling with (and which needs more testing) is urls in CSS |
| 21:54 | <Hixie> | that one is conveniently not my problem :-) |
| 21:54 | <Hixie> | but yeah |
| 21:55 | <Hixie> | audio was easy to test because i can hear it |
| 21:55 | <Hixie> | now to test <img>... |
| 21:55 | <Hixie> | maybe i need a counter cgi that returns a different number each time or something |
| 21:56 | <aklein> | I would have posted a live dom viewer example for that if it had been easy...I just did it locally |
| 21:58 | <Hixie> | hehe |
| 22:28 | <Hixie> | aklein: firefox isn't doing anything when the img is inserted into another doc either: http://software.hixie.ch/utilities/js/live-dom-viewer/?saved=2758 |
| 22:30 | <Hixie> | but if the resolved url is different, then it does |
| 22:30 | <Hixie> | interesting |
| 22:34 | <Hixie> | anyone got IE around to test with the three tests in https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=24312 ? |
| 22:39 | <JonathanNeal> | Hixie: still need someone to look? |
| 22:43 | <Hixie> | JonathanNeal: yup |
| 22:48 | <Hixie> | is it me, or is textContent wrong for elements? http://dom.spec.whatwg.org/#dom-node-textcontent |
| 22:48 | <Hixie> | it says to replace the nodes, but i thought if the only child was a text node, it was preserved |
| 22:52 | <TabAtkins> | We were just talking about this on blink-dev, and we think we want to change the spec to preserve the node in that case. |
| 22:53 | <Hixie> | k well i'll assume Top People are on it then |
| 22:53 | <JonathanNeal> | Hixie: unsure of how to follow the test, but I have IE up. |
| 22:53 | <Hixie> | JonathanNeal: ok, let me walk you through it |
| 22:54 | <Hixie> | JonathanNeal: http://software.hixie.ch/utilities/js/live-dom-viewer/saved/2755 - what audio plays? |
| 22:54 | <Hixie> | JonathanNeal: and what does it say in the log? |
| 22:54 | <JonathanNeal> | It actually says "Invalid Source" to me in IE11 |
| 22:55 | <Hixie> | ugh |
| 22:55 | <Hixie> | ok, let's ignore that. |
| 22:55 | <Hixie> | ok, next test. uh |
| 22:55 | <Hixie> | http://software.hixie.ch/utilities/js/live-dom-viewer/saved/2758 |
| 22:56 | <Hixie> | there should be two numbers in the log |
| 22:56 | <Hixie> | what are they? |
| 22:57 | <JonathanNeal> | checking |
| 22:57 | <JonathanNeal> | the two numbers are 27 and 0 |
| 22:58 | <Hixie> | 0! |
| 22:58 | <Hixie> | interesting |
| 22:58 | <Hixie> | and in http://software.hixie.ch/utilities/js/live-dom-viewer/saved/2759 ? |
| 22:59 | <Hixie> | (should be two numbers again) |
| 23:03 | <JonathanNeal> | just a moment |
| 23:03 | <Hixie> | no rush |
| 23:03 | <JonathanNeal> | 17, 0 |
| 23:05 | <Hixie> | JonathanNeal: fascinating. thanks. |
| 23:09 | <JonathanNeal> | what does it mean? |
| 23:24 | <Hixie> | JonathanNeal: means that IE is further away from the other browsers than is useful to include IE in our sample set :-) |
| 23:49 | <Hixie> | man |
| 23:49 | <Hixie> | i could really do with dreamhost giving me more visibility into what processes are taking up all the memory when it decides that my machine is out of RAM and should be rebooted |