| 07:06 | <MikeSmith> | well that's weird |
| 07:07 | <MikeSmith> | $ git fetch |
| 07:07 | <MikeSmith> | fatal: Cannot fetch both refs/pull/610/head and refs/heads/pr/610 to refs/remotes/origin/pr/610 |
| 07:11 | <MikeSmith> | botie, inform Ms2ger seems like the "pr/610" branch you created conflicts with the existing name that git creates for anybody who has followed https://github.com/whatwg/html/blob/pr/610/TEAM.md#fetching-and-reviewing-pull-requests-from-forks to set up automatic fetch of branches for PRs from forks |
| 07:16 | <MikeSmith> | botie, inform Ms2ger seems like the "pr/610" branch you created conflicts with the existing name that git creates for anybody who has followed https://github.com/whatwg/html/blob/pr/610/TEAM.md#fetching-and-reviewing-pull-requests-from-forks to set up automatic fetch of branches for PRs from forks |
| 07:16 | <botie> | will do |
| 07:21 | <MikeSmith> | botie, inform Ms2ger if you rename that branch I think that will fix the problem |
| 07:21 | <botie> | will do |
| 08:44 | <annevk> | philipj: thanks for the review |
| 08:52 | <botie> | Ms2ger, at 2016-02-03 07:17 UTC, MikeSmith said: seems like the "pr/610" branch you created conflicts with the existing name that git creates for anybody who has followed https://github.com/whatwg/html/blob/pr/610/TEAM.md#fetching-and-reviewing-pull-requests-from-forks to set up automatic fetch of branches |
| 08:52 | <botie> | for PRs from forks and at 2016-02-03 07:22 UTC, MikeSmith said: if you rename that branch I think that will fix the problem |
| 08:58 | <Ms2ger> | jgraham_, r? https://critic.hoppipolla.co.uk/r/6019 |
| 09:01 | <Ms2ger> | MikeSmith, no clue what you're on about |
| 09:04 | <annevk> | Ms2ger: you named a branch pr/610 which conflicts with an automatic local branching generating mechanism we use |
| 09:05 | <annevk> | Ms2ger: it seems that branch is already merged though so we can simply delete it |
| 09:05 | <annevk> | hmm or maybe you didn't do that and it was someone else |
| 09:05 | <annevk> | might have been Domenic who merged it |
| 09:07 | <Ms2ger> | In what repo? |
| 09:07 | <annevk> | Ms2ger: whatwg/html |
| 09:07 | <Ms2ger> | I don't have access there, so wasn't me :) |
| 09:07 | <annevk> | I see |
| 09:07 | <annevk> | MikeSmith: I deleted the branch |
| 09:22 | <MikeSmith> | annevk: thanks |
| 09:23 | <MikeSmith> | Ms2ger: sorry for blaming you |
| 09:23 | <Ms2ger> | Np |
| 09:38 | <annevk> | Does anyone remember why we call entities "named character references"? |
| 09:38 | <jgraham_> | Ms2ger: r+ |
| 09:39 | <Ms2ger> | Ta |
| 09:44 | <MikeSmith> | annevk: I thought Hixie minted that |
| 09:45 | <MikeSmith> | "entities" was the original, what they were called from the SGML days |
| 09:45 | <MikeSmith> | right? |
| 09:46 | <annevk> | I have no idea anymore |
| 09:48 | <annevk> | It hasn't been quite a decade yet, but the HTML parser exists for nine years now: https://annevankesteren.nl/2006/12/html-parser |
| 09:49 | <JakeA> | jsbell: wanderview: so add() & addAll() should reject on response !ok or if the response is opaque (since we can't leak OK) |
| 09:49 | annevk | finds https://annevankesteren.nl/2006/10/html-wg |
| 09:51 | <Ms2ger> | > But am I just being paranoid in observing that the announcement doesn�t read as an endorsement of HTML5 but as an announcement to develop another spec that incrementally improves HTML? |
| 09:51 | <Ms2ger> | Well fuck |
| 09:51 | <annevk> | Oh look, the parser is a decade old now: https://annevankesteren.nl/2006/01/parsing |
| 09:51 | <annevk> | We didn't even celebrate |
| 09:52 | <annevk> | 🎉🎂 |
| 09:52 | <annevk> | Ms2ger: that rare time hsivonen makes an observation, pay attention |
| 09:54 | <annevk> | philipj: you don't like my idea of just defining an algorithm in the HTML standard for how to extract CLDR data for quotes? |
| 09:55 | <annevk> | philipj: if you think that's too difficult I'm willing to give that a shot |
| 09:55 | <annevk> | philipj: by drawing inspiration from what was done ECMAScript 402 |
| 09:55 | <annevk> | for* |
| 09:57 | <philipj> | annevk: that would amount to removing the CSS block from the spec, right? |
| 09:57 | <philipj> | annevk: the thing is, I saw that block copied into a test in Blink, so it's been of some use at least once |
| 09:58 | <annevk> | philipj: yeah, can basically drop all the build code |
| 09:58 | <annevk> | philipj: I see |
| 09:58 | <annevk> | hmm |
| 09:59 | <philipj> | annevk: how would this ES 402 thing work? I looked at a spec someone linked to yesterday and couldn't find what I was supposed to find |
| 09:59 | <philipj> | someone=you I think |
| 10:01 | <MikeSmith> | "I would urge you to wait until the WG is actually formed and the charter and membership are apparent before assuming it means victory for the forces of good." |
| 10:01 | <annevk> | philipj: I haven't looked in detail, but that spec has some relation to CLDR too |
| 10:02 | <annevk> | philipj: though it doesn't directly depend on it since there could be alternative implementations |
| 10:02 | <annevk> | philipj: so you'd have some phrasing around using the locale quotation mark for locale /x/ or some such I suppose, haven't done the work yet |
| 10:03 | <annevk> | philipj: but if the CSS is of use, perhaps we should just bear the cost, I wonder though what the implementation does |
| 10:03 | <zcorpan> | DOMTokenList change was picked up pretty quickly |
| 10:05 | <philipj> | annevk: so are there APIs for getting the locale-dependent quotation marks? |
| 10:06 | <zcorpan> | getComputedStyle? |
| 10:06 | <annevk> | philipj: nope, it'd be inspired by |
| 10:06 | <philipj> | annevk: oh, ok... |
| 10:06 | <annevk> | philipj: although maybe quotation marks are setup wildly different from currency in which case it wouldn't help I suppose |
| 10:06 | <annevk> | but I was assuming that would not be the case |
| 10:11 | zcorpan | -> dubai -> stockholm |
| 10:12 | <philipj> | annevk: looks like there's not agreement about whether the computed style for the quotes property has the quotes actually used or not |
| 10:12 | <philipj> | Gecko does, Blink not |
| 10:12 | <annevk> | philipj: I don't really know how the quotes property works, let's check what CSS says |
| 10:14 | <annevk> | philipj: per https://drafts.csswg.org/css-content-3/#propdef-quotes it should be the specified value |
| 10:14 | <philipj> | annevk: in Blink, there's a table of quotes in the source code, with a comment saying "Table of quotes from http://www.whatwg.org/specs/web-apps/current-work/multipage/rendering.html#quote"; |
| 10:14 | <annevk> | philipj: I see, so Blink doesn't use CLDR directly either |
| 10:14 | <annevk> | hmm |
| 10:15 | <philipj> | annevk: no. I would have expected to find a call to libicu, but nope, that's not how it works |
| 10:15 | <annevk> | seems weird from an engineering perspective to embed multiple sources of truth with your software |
| 10:15 | <philipj> | can we just nuke this "feature" and let people use CSS? :) |
| 10:15 | <philipj> | I'm not sure that libicu actually has this data, just guessing |
| 10:16 | <annevk> | well, if JavaScript can get CLDR data... |
| 10:16 | <annevk> | I guess they might exclude the quotes stuff though when shipping |
| 10:16 | <philipj> | well, *can* JavaScript get the quotes data? what's the API? |
| 10:17 | <annevk> | I don't think there's an API at the moment |
| 10:17 | <annevk> | We could maybe email www-international and see what they say about all this |
| 10:17 | <annevk> | They likely have more of a clue |
| 10:19 | <philipj> | yeah |
| 10:20 | <philipj> | In the meantime, I'd like to make it precompiled, because I keep having to redownload the cldr repo every day whenever I've changed the html-build commit |
| 10:23 | <annevk> | Yeah I think that's great |
| 10:23 | <annevk> | That way we also know when the output changes so we can file bugs on browsers |
| 10:28 | <annevk> | Domenic: retweeted @webkit |
| 10:28 | <annevk> | Domenic: do you still have trouble logging in due to needing to know the email address? If so, I'll add them all |
| 10:47 | <annevk> | JakeA: see https://github.com/whatwg/html/issues/552 on <style scoped> |
| 10:51 | <mounir> | heycam|away: any chance you can have a look at https://github.com/heycam/webidl/pull/85 ? |
| 10:51 | <JakeA> | annevk: I agree that out-of-order CSS loading is desirable in some cases, but isn't <link async> a simpler answer? I guess I never got the benefit of style scoping since selectors already let you scope styles |
| 10:52 | <JakeA> | Eg, if CSS had a way to refer to the parent of the <style> or <link>, there's your scoping |
| 10:53 | <JakeA> | :container .foo { ... } |
| 10:59 | <annevk> | JakeA: that'd be pretty cool |
| 10:59 | <annevk> | JakeA: <link async> doesn't exist yet |
| 10:59 | <annevk> | JakeA: btw, now you can PR the HTML standard for adding those promise properties, e.g., <img>.loaded, or whatever name it'll be |
| 11:02 | <JakeA> | annevk: yeah, hoping to find time to make an HTML PR this quarter. I thought it'd be the <link> in <body> thing but that's more contentious than I thought |
| 11:04 | <annevk> | JakeA: oh is it? |
| 11:04 | <annevk> | JakeA: removing <style scoped> seems a little contentious, but then only Gecko implements it |
| 11:06 | <JakeA> | annevk: https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/forum/m/#!topic/blink-dev/ZAPP8aTnyn0 |
| 13:19 | <Ms2ger> | https://gregwhitworth.github.io/css-table-3/ |
| 13:25 | <annevk> | Interesting, it says that something about the WHATWG stylesheet is wrong |
| 15:09 | <Domenic> | annevk: honestly I haven't tried since the one; adding the emails would be great |
| 15:10 | <annevk> | Domenic: do you have a little bit of time? |
| 15:10 | <annevk> | Domenic: I want to talk cross-origin objects |
| 15:10 | <Domenic> | annevk: just woke up, so not too much :) |
| 15:10 | <annevk> | Because I'm confusing myself |
| 15:10 | <Domenic> | annevk: but if this is the best timezone wise I can make it work |
| 15:11 | <Domenic> | In fact yeah let's do now, meeting-day kicks off in 2 hours |
| 15:11 | <annevk> | Basically the problem is the own property thing |
| 15:11 | <annevk> | So IDL sets up Location, and also a LocationPrototype |
| 15:11 | <annevk> | Does that mean we also need to overwrite all the internal methods of LocationPrototype somehow? |
| 15:13 | <Domenic> | annevk: maybe. Without overwriting them, people will be able to treat Location.prototype as an ordinary object, e.g. try to do Location.prototype.assign.call(otherLocation, ...) |
| 15:13 | <Domenic> | It depends on what you are trying to prevent |
| 15:14 | <Domenic> | Your CrossOriginGetPrototypeOf already returns null for cross origin |
| 15:14 | <Domenic> | So anything that proto-walks will stop before it sees Location.prototype |
| 15:14 | <annevk> | Yeah, but if you store Location.prototype and then set document.domain you still have it |
| 15:15 | <Domenic> | yeah. but i'm unclear what threat model that gives you |
| 15:15 | <annevk> | Though perhaps the "platform object" security check fails at that point |
| 15:16 | <annevk> | Note that for Location this also applies to the same-origin case |
| 15:17 | <annevk> | To make it appear as if things are configurable |
| 15:17 | <Domenic> | So it would really help to have a concrete model of what we're trying to prevent |
| 15:18 | <Domenic> | and then we can tell if the existing spec sufficiently does that |
| 15:18 | <annevk> | I think what this is instead is having some carefully crafted extensions to SOP due to compat issues |
| 15:19 | <annevk> | I see your point though, let me try to write something up |
| 15:20 | <annevk> | Of what I think we want to accomplish |
| 15:20 | <Domenic> | I see, you are saying that other objects just fail at step 2 of perform a security check |
| 15:20 | <Domenic> | Well, LocationPrototype and WindowPrototype should fail at that same step |
| 15:20 | <Domenic> | So I guess the question is whether that's desired |
| 15:21 | <Domenic> | I think it probably is |
| 15:21 | <Domenic> | Also "carefully crafted extensions to SOP due to compat issues" is a great way of framing this whole thing and I hope to see it in an intro paragraph at some point. |
| 15:22 | <annevk> | Yeah, though we do want to get to those functions in the cross-origin case to be able to pretend they are own properties instead |
| 15:22 | <annevk> | But I'll write it up and then maybe you can help design it |
| 15:46 | <annevk> | Wrote something up, time to do some other stuff for a bit |
| 16:28 | <JonathanNeal> | Why is it the spec https://www.w3.org/TR/css3-background/#special-backgrounds recommends authors specify the canvas background for the BODY element rather than the HTML element? |
| 16:32 | <wanderview> | JakeA: we're ok with Cache.addAll() failing opaqueredirect responses, right? That won't mess up offline support for sites requiring navigation redirects? |
| 16:34 | <wanderview> | I guess they can just avoid the convenience methods |
| 17:55 | <annevk> | MikeSmith: any idea what is up with Bugzilla? |
| 17:55 | <MikeSmith> | nope |
| 17:55 | <MikeSmith> | not responding? |
| 17:55 | MikeSmith | checks |
| 17:55 | <MikeSmith> | redirect loop it seems |
| 17:55 | MikeSmith | alerts systems team |
| 18:07 | <MikeSmith> | annevk: systems team is aware of the problem but I think waiting on the particular person who maintains the bugzilla instance |
| 18:08 | <MikeSmith> | who likely is eating dinner or so atm |
| 18:09 | <tobie> | I'd like the Sensor constructor to throw when instantiated outside of the top level browsing context (for now). What should I throw, a SecurityError? |
| 18:10 | <tobie> | Note the constructor already throws a SecurityError if outside of https. |
| 18:11 | <annevk> | seems fine |
| 18:14 | <tobie> | ty |
| 18:14 | <MikeSmith> | tobie: incidentally, you writing wpt tests for that as you're writing/developing it? |
| 18:14 | <tobie> | MikeSmith: that's a good question. |
| 18:15 | <MikeSmith> | you could pioneer that and set a good example for others |
| 18:15 | <miketaylr> | i need to write some wpt tests... |
| 18:15 | <MikeSmith> | WDD (WPT Driven Development) |
| 18:16 | <tobie> | or WPTDD |
| 18:16 | <MikeSmith> | miketaylr: the lavish rewards it brings are worth the pain |
| 18:16 | <tobie> | MikeSmith: ^ this |
| 18:16 | <miketaylr> | MikeSmith: yeah i can imagine my .NET mag awards already |
| 18:17 | <miketaylr> | might write the acceptance speech before the test |
| 18:17 | <tobie> | miketaylr: these things give you Emmys nowadays. |
| 18:17 | <MikeSmith> | we need an award, a statuette of jgraham |
| 18:17 | <tobie> | ^ worst nightmares |
| 18:18 | <miketaylr> | never needed a 3d printer before today |
| 18:18 | <MikeSmith> | hahah |
| 18:18 | <MikeSmith> | WPTSD, WPT Post Traumatic Stress Disorder |
| 18:19 | <MikeSmith> | annevk: bugzilla is back |
| 18:21 | <MikeSmith> | "might write the acceptance speech before the test" deserves an award on its own |
| 18:21 | <Domenic> | i think this idea actually has legs |
| 18:21 | <Domenic> | a 3d-printed statue of jgraham handed out each year to the best test-writer in a formal ceremony over the internet |
| 18:22 | <Domenic> | i would write more tests |
| 18:22 | <darobin> | hahahaha |
| 18:22 | <darobin> | that would be wonderful |
| 18:22 | <darobin> | I would write all the tests |
| 18:22 | <darobin> | especially if the statue came with lavish hair |
| 18:23 | <darobin> | I think there may be precedent for writing WPT tests during the spec writing |
| 18:24 | <darobin> | maybe AnssiK did that for Vibration? |
| 18:24 | <darobin> | that might have been pre-WPT, but using testharness |
| 18:24 | <Domenic> | i kiiiind of did it for streams, just, not in WPT format... so now I am converting them all to WPT... good job me |
| 18:24 | <darobin> | "just not in WPT format" pretty much sums up the story of the project |
| 18:25 | <miketaylr> | i have a q1 goal to write some for the compat spec, hopefully that doesn't end up as "start day before q1 ends" |
| 18:25 | <darobin> | does it say Q1 of any specific year? |
| 18:25 | <miketaylr> | oh snap, good point |
| 18:25 | <miketaylr> | excited to win the Q1 2020 jgraham-y |
| 18:27 | <jgraham> | I'd go with "test-y" |
| 18:27 | <darobin> | no no |
| 18:27 | <darobin> | jgrahammy |
| 18:27 | <darobin> | it has to be |
| 18:28 | <MikeSmith> | yep |
| 18:28 | <MikeSmith> | this is the most productive brainstorming we have done for years |
| 18:28 | <darobin> | and they say standards are slow |
| 18:28 | <MikeSmith> | haha |
| 19:52 | <nikkibee> | https://fetch.spec.whatwg.org/#cors-check I don't understand how this can ever resolve past step 2. I cannot find anywhere where `Access-Control-Allow-Origin` is set in the Fetch specification, and so far in my testing no other function I call for Response sets it |
| 19:53 | <nikkibee> | https://fetch.spec.whatwg.org/#http-access-control-allow-origin this says the http response can include the header, but where does that happen? I don't see where to read next |
| 20:01 | <annevk> | nikkibee: the server specifies it |
| 20:01 | <annevk> | nikkibee: the client doesn't really control the response |
| 20:02 | <annevk> | nikkibee: it just gets one |
| 20:02 | <nikkibee> | annevk: I see. what specification talks about this? I'd like to figure out what Fetch is calling that needs to handle this |
| 20:03 | <JakeA> | wanderview: yeah, happy for add to fail in that case |
| 20:03 | <annevk> | nikkibee: I don't really understand your confusion |
| 20:03 | <nikkibee> | annevk: I don't know when Response gets its headers set |
| 20:04 | <nikkibee> | so I don't know where to add this header, since it's not being set, and I need it for Cors Check to work |
| 20:05 | <annevk> | nikkibee: oh, step four of https://fetch.spec.whatwg.org/#http-network-fetch |
| 20:05 | <annevk> | nikkibee: are you implementing a server or a client? |
| 20:05 | <annevk> | nikkibee: a client doesn't add this header, it just receives it as part of a response |
| 20:05 | <nikkibee> | annevk: okay, the implementation for step 4 in Servo calls something outside of Fetch so I'll see what's going on there |
| 20:06 | <nikkibee> | annevk: I don't know how to answer that, sorry |
| 20:06 | <Domenic> | "To request an account, ask an autoconfirmed user on IRC (such as one of these permanent autoconfirmed members)" |
| 20:06 | <Domenic> | I am an autoconfirmed member, and someone is asking for my help signing up to the wiki. How do I do it? |
| 20:07 | <annevk> | Domenic: https://wiki.whatwg.org/wiki/WHATWG_Wiki:How_to_create_a_user_account (linked from the main page) |
| 20:07 | <Domenic> | waah waaah |
| 20:08 | <annevk> | nikkibee: so part of the problem here might be integration between Fetch and HTTP being not exactly ideal |
| 20:08 | <annevk> | nikkibee: there's a bit of handwaving |
| 20:08 | <annevk> | nikkibee: I don't know if I'll ever get the HTTP folks to provide adequate hooks though |
| 20:10 | <nikkibee> | annevk: anything outside of Fetch is kind of over my head, but I'd rather not have the Cors Check function just return success so that I can continue. I don't know what the HTTP hooks could be like or how it would help |
| 20:11 | <annevk> | nikkibee: well, things would be more clear |
| 20:12 | <annevk> | nikkibee: but anyway, the way this works is that Fetch sets up a connection, transmits a Request over it and a Response comes back |
| 20:12 | <annevk> | nikkibee: the Response will have headers set and such |
| 20:12 | <annevk> | nikkibee: which may be correct for CORS, or not |
| 20:13 | <nikkibee> | I'm getting a better idea of it, thanks |
| 20:13 | <annevk> | nikkibee: some of those details are defined by HTTP, some by Fetch, where they get close it's not as tightly defined as I would like |
| 20:13 | <nikkibee> | I've been focusing on the small details so the big overview is harder for me |
| 20:13 | <nikkibee> | I see |
| 20:13 | <annevk> | no worries |
| 20:14 | <annevk> | I guess this is the first time someone approaches this with a Fetch-first perspective |
| 20:14 | <nikkibee> | heh! |
| 20:14 | <annevk> | usually folks know the HTTP bit |
| 20:14 | <nikkibee> | I haven't really paid attention to headers until now, when a header is absolutely required |
| 20:15 | <nikkibee> | I didn't find it mentioned in the fetch spec so I figured it was handled already and went ahead with coding Cors Check, I guess that was a bit shortsighted |
| 20:29 | <miketaylr> | annevk: want me to open an issue against DOM? |
| 20:29 | <annevk> | miketaylr: PR? |
| 20:29 | <annevk> | miketaylr: either way is fine |
| 20:29 | <miketaylr> | that too |
| 20:29 | <annevk> | miketaylr: happy to help, but it's sleepy time here |
| 20:30 | <annevk> | miketaylr: that's pretty horrid though, much worse than webkitMatchesSelector |
| 20:30 | <miketaylr> | annevk: go to bed, i'll file an issue and try to have a PR tomorrow-ish (and you can tell me all the ways i did it wrong in review) |
| 20:30 | <annevk> | good times |
| 20:30 | <miketaylr> | welcome to the jungle |
| 20:32 | <miketaylr> | *jongel https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=13898 |
| 20:37 | <Domenic> | this is the worst https://github.com/whatwg/compat/issues/24 |
| 20:43 | <tobie> | Looking at the automotive stuff and TAG feedback of their pub/sub pattern (rough e.g. vehicle.subscribe ("speed", callback))… |
| 20:43 | <tobie> | and curious about folk's thoughts here. |
| 20:44 | <tobie> | I'd imagine this would be best designed as an EventTarget… |
| 20:45 | <tobie> | But feedback seems to consider this a matter of taste. |
| 20:45 | <tobie> | And points to MutationObservers as a good example of callback based observing. |
| 20:46 | <Domenic> | I think it ... does not reflect well ... that the TAG is spending time on this API. |
| 20:46 | <tobie> | Well… that's another story altogether, really. :) |
| 20:47 | <tobie> | I don't disagree, but I could reformulate the question without mentioning the AM spec at all. |
| 20:48 | <tobie> | I'm interested in the long term view for events on the Web… |
| 20:48 | <Domenic> | fair |
| 20:48 | <tobie> | …and the possibility of a convergence with node EventEmitters. |
| 20:48 | <Domenic> | I think the story is "use addEventListener" and maybe one day observables will become a thing |
| 20:49 | <tobie> | OK, so this is my understanding too. |
| 20:49 | <caitp> | I thought that netflix dude was really committed to making that happen |
| 20:49 | <tobie> | Which is why I'm utterly confused when I hear the TAG (or members of the TAG) say: just create your own pus/sub system, it's cool. |
| 20:50 | <Domenic> | as long as nobody does it on specs that are actually going to be implemented... |
| 20:51 | <tobie> | heh |
| 21:05 | <tobie> | What's blocking observables? |
| 21:14 | <Domenic> | it's unclear whether they're a good primitive at all. |
| 22:14 | <tobie> | Domenic: Is there agreement that some form of event dispatcher thingy is a good primitive to have, though? |
| 22:14 | <Domenic> | tobie: unclear it needs to be in the language, I guess. |
| 22:14 | <Domenic> | each ecosystem already has one; inventing a third is of unclear benefit |
| 22:16 | <tobie> | Domenic: what's the stroy with streams, there? |
| 22:16 | <tobie> | Can I use some of the node.js stream stuff inside of service workers? |
| 22:18 | <tobie> | e.g. a zip lib to store zipped filed in the cache storage? |
| 22:19 | <tobie> | (arguably contrived example) |
| 22:26 | <Domenic> | tobie: yeah working toward that (although the API surface is a bit different than Node streams) |
| 22:26 | <Domenic> | right now behind experimental web platform features we allow you to compose streaming responses fed from a service worker to the main page |
| 22:27 | <tobie> | sorry, my question was badly formulated: |
| 22:28 | <tobie> | In the future, can I grab a nodejs module that does zipping and use it in a service worker? |
| 22:28 | <tobie> | Or will the streams APIs be incompatible? |
| 22:32 | <Domenic> | they will be incompatible: https://github.com/whatwg/streams/blob/master/FAQ.md#what-are-the-main-differences-between-these-streams-and-nodejs-streams |
| 22:37 | <tobie> | Domenic: is there a path to convergence? Or is this just: these are two incompatible platforms; live with it. |
| 22:38 | <Domenic> | tobie: node streams is in active discussions right now about addressing their shortcomings, and one of their primary champions is a fan of whatwg streams, so i anticipate some gradual movement over time. |
| 22:38 | <tobie> | \o/ |
| 22:41 | <tobie> | Is convergence an end goal, though? |
| 22:42 | <tobie> | Basically, is someone actively looking at the pieces that are missing to make a large chunk of node.js code runnable in the browser? |
| 22:45 | <Domenic> | i don't think that's really a goal, no |
| 22:45 | <Domenic> | node made its own weird or ahead-of-the-curve choices which most implementers find absurd |
| 22:45 | <Domenic> | shims suffice pretty much |
| 22:53 | <tobie> | So there are shims that let me transparently do that? |
| 22:55 | <Domenic> | yeah, browserify bundles a bunch |
| 22:57 | <tobie> | Right but they're shims for basic things like the file system, no? |
| 22:59 | <tobie> | Also implies nodejs => Web, not nodejs <=> Web, plus their a transpiling step, etc. |
| 23:01 | <tobie> | Anyway, misspelling "there are" that badly seems to indicate it is time to go to sleep. |