WHATWG
2023-09-26
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03:40
<martin>

The HTML spec currently contains the following sentence:

When the steps below require the user agent to insert an HTML element for a token, the user agent must insert a foreign element for the token, in the HTML namespace.

(emphasis mine)

I think it's rather confusing for the "insert a foreign element" procedure to be called that when it is also used for non-foreign elements. I think it would make more sense for it to just be called "insert an element". What do you think about this?

05:28
<annevk>
martin: I think that's a reasonable rename. mfreed is touching that step in the declarative shadow tree PR so maybe we don't want to rename it until after that lands.
06:27
<Noam Rosenthal>
zcorpan, annevk I want to proceed on the reveal/readytorender event we discussed at TPAC for view-transitions (https://github.com/whatwg/html/issues/9315). seems like there was rough consensus about the direction, I want to see we're ok with the details
07:37
<sideshowbarker>

annevk: About <link disabled>, can you point me to the specific step in https://drafts.csswg.org/cssom/ that requires setting the owner node to null?

I’m not questioning it — I just want to add a spec link to the commit message for https://github.com/WebKit/WebKit/pull/17001

And I’m specifically looking at the part of the test case at https://github.com/web-platform-tests/wpt/blob/master/css/cssom/HTMLLinkElement-disabled-002.html#L26

08:02
<annevk>
Domenic: I was hoping you could have a look at https://github.com/whatwg/spec-factory/pull/34 too; it's old but still relevant
08:03
<annevk>
sideshowbarker: I don't see it in https://drafts.csswg.org/cssom/#the-stylesheet-interface and I think emilio wrote those tests, so maybe he can elaborate
08:10
<emilio>

sideshowbarker: annevk: Seems like a bug in the CSSOM spec. The ownerNode is mutable, and goes away when the node -> sheet link goes away. E.g., this interoperably logs <style> then null:

<!doctype html>
<style>div {}</style>
<script>
  let sheet = document.querySelector("style").sheet;
  console.log(sheet);
  console.log(sheet.ownerNode);
  sheet.ownerNode.remove();
  console.log(sheet.ownerNode);
</script>
08:17
<annevk>
emilio: I think that specific scenario is covered by https://drafts.csswg.org/cssom/#remove-a-css-style-sheet
08:18
<annevk>
I think the problem is that there's no equivalent logic around disabling
09:11
<annevk>
Sketch for the new feature/issue templates: https://github.com/annevk/temp-whatwg-new-issue/issues/new/choose cc Domenic keithamus muan zcorpan sideshowbarker
09:12
<annevk>
(That link will 404 at some point because GitHub doesn't 410 I think. You should be able to find it in spec-factory then.)
09:13
<zcorpan>
annevk: very nice!
09:13
<keithamus>
Oh this looks great!
09:28
<sideshowbarker>
oh wow I didn’t know you could put in a outside link like that (the chat link)
09:28
<annevk>
Yeah maybe I should put some more links there now I know how that looks
09:30
<sideshowbarker>
The inline chat link in the new issue template is great too
09:30
<sideshowbarker>
And the required “What problem are you trying to solve?” field (in the new-feature template)
09:34
<annevk>
"What would you say you do here?"
10:44
<sideshowbarker>
So 20 years ago this month is when Hixie published the first version of what would eventually lead to “HTML5” and the modern HTML spec http://www.hixie.ch/specs/html/forms/hfp.html (titled “XHTML Module: Extensions to Form Controls”)
10:47
<annevk>
I vaguely recall a declarative version of http://www.hixie.ch/specs/html/forms/hfp.html#TOC51
10:48
<sideshowbarker>
Maybe that came later? somewhere in https://platform.html5.org/history/
10:59
<sideshowbarker>
I think the problem is that there's no equivalent logic around disabling

emilio: You able to make time to update the CSSOM spec to add a “disable a CSS stylesheet” algorithm? (Assuming you’re still the current editor.) Also I guess the HTML spec would need to be updated too, to add a call site to that new algorithm — at https://html.spec.whatwg.org/multipage/semantics.html#the-link-element:attr-link-disabled-2 I suppose?

Or else I can try to write up a patch for it myself. Lemme know

11:00
<annevk>
I don't see it in the history, but https://whatwg.org/specs/web-forms/current-work/#repeatingFormControls has it. I think Opera supported something like it at one point.
11:03
<sideshowbarker>
I don't see it in the history, but https://whatwg.org/specs/web-forms/current-work/#repeatingFormControls has it. I think Opera supported something like it at one point.
ah yeah I remember that now
11:07
<zcorpan>
sideshowbarker: there is a "disabled flag" on StyleSheet
11:07
<zcorpan>
https://drafts.csswg.org/cssom/#concept-css-style-sheet-disabled-flag
11:13
<annevk>
zcorpan: the problem is that owner node isn't updated, see upthread
11:19
<zcorpan>
annevk: I see. Seems like the behavior is https://drafts.csswg.org/cssom/#remove-a-css-style-sheet ?
11:20
<zcorpan>
annevk: does the spec say what to do when removing a link or style element from the document? I couldn't find anything
11:30
<anouk s>
hi i have a problem with a site that i've made. it works great on chrome but it doesnt work on firefox. i have a html form and the data is stored in a json file. when the user has paid the file goes to a php file and the data is taken from the json file. but when i try this in firefox it doesnt work i get this TypeError: NetworkError when attempting to fetch resource
12:00
<annevk>
zcorpan: that's defined, yes, remove a style sheet is called; but there's nothing like that for enabling/disabling
12:00
<zcorpan>
annevk: what's the difference?
12:00
<annevk>
anouk s: that's prolly better suited for Stack Overflow (and you'll need to provide more details there)
12:01
<zcorpan>
Maybe enabling again doesn't create a new stylesheet
12:04
<zcorpan>
Ian Hickson: saving in live dom viewer seems to give an internal error
12:05
<zcorpan>

annevk: different behavior for re-enabling in safari vs chrome/firefox:

<!DOCTYPE html>
<link rel=stylesheet href="data:text/css,html{background:yellow} " id=x> 
<script>
onload = () => {
var sheet = x.sheet;
w(document.styleSheets.length)
x.disabled = true;
w(sheet.ownerNode)
w(document.styleSheets.length)
x.disabled = false;
w(sheet === x.sheet);
}
</script>
12:08
<anouk s>
thank you i'm going over there. hopefully they can help me
13:43
<annevk>
keithamus: if there's some secret syntax by which you can omit the label from the output let me know, https://github.com/annevk/temp-whatwg-new-issue/issues/2 is a little ugly given there's only one input field in the end but workable
13:43
<annevk>
As in, I'd prefer "What is the issue?" not to be there
13:50
<keithamus>
I'm not sure that's possible without abusing the format by adding another field or stuffing the heading into the description.
14:00
<annevk>
keithamus: thanks
14:00
<annevk>
I wrote https://github.com/orgs/community/discussions/63402#discussioncomment-7113247. Maybe it'll help
14:05
<keithamus>
I’ll put it in front of the feature engineers for that feature and see if they can prioritise it.
18:26
<annevk>
Jeffrey Yasskin: if you have thoughts on https://github.com/annevk/temp-whatwg-new-issue/issues/new/choose or https://github.com/whatwg/spec-factory/pull/49 I'd appreciate them
18:27
<annevk>
One thing I realized with the new/choose URL is that we probably want to link there directly rather than link to new. It would also break zcorpan's script, though we might be able to make that work still.
18:33
<Jeffrey Yasskin>
Jeffrey Yasskin: if you have thoughts on https://github.com/annevk/temp-whatwg-new-issue/issues/new/choose or https://github.com/whatwg/spec-factory/pull/49 I'd appreciate them
I love both of them. I'm sure I will eventually find things I want to change, but I don't see any right now, and I can send PRs whenever I notice something. 😍
22:28
<jarhar>
i just filed an issue for selectlist and id like to use the new stages process for it, what should i do?: https://github.com/whatwg/html/issues/9799
22:29
<jarhar>
i see that yall are working on new issue templates, would those prompt for the usage of the new stages?
22:29
<jarhar>
i could re-file the issue later if thats the case
22:38
<akaster>
Domenic: it looks like fireNavigateEventOnCommit is unused in `apply the history step`. Is this refactoring leftovers or some missing functionality?
22:40
<Jeffrey Yasskin>
i just filed an issue for selectlist and id like to use the new stages process for it, what should i do?: https://github.com/whatwg/html/issues/9799
I believe cwilso is on the hook to finish up the details of the stages system.
23:26
<akaster>
Is a null "origin or null" same origin with another null "origin or null"?
23:28
<Domenic>
Domenic: it looks like fireNavigateEventOnCommit is unused in `apply the history step`. Is this refactoring leftovers or some missing functionality?
Can you please file a bug so I can investigate? Chat messages are too easily lost.
23:34
<akaster>
Sure thing, I filled issue #9800 for this