| 00:10 | <dbaron> | TabAtkins_, actually, Hixie filed it for me (as I noticed after posting to www-style) |
| 00:12 | <TabAtkins_> | Ah, heh. |
| 00:12 | <TabAtkins_> | Well, as long as it's filed, I'm happy. |
| 04:48 | <zewt> | heh youtube seems to be out to give <video> a boost by switching to hopelessly broken buffering behavior |
| 04:48 | <zewt> | now it won't buffer more than 30 seconds ahead, which means i ... can't watch things |
| 04:48 | <zewt> | (unless i feel like watching it in 30 second chunks) |
| 05:00 | <Hixie> | you can't watch online? |
| 05:02 | <zewt> | it won't stream fast enough to watch it |
| 05:02 | <zewt> | normally i'd just pause it and let it buffer to full in the background ... but now it stops buffering after the buffer is 30s ahead of the play position, which broke that |
| 05:04 | <Hixie> | it doesn't buffer fast enough even if it's playing? |
| 05:06 | <zewt> | wow, the html5 player is doing it too (capping the buffer); wonder if that's something they're doing in script (can you even do that?) or if FF is doing the same thing |
| 05:07 | <Hixie> | i would assume it's the server |
| 05:08 | <zewt> | oh wait, the html5 one kept buffering (eventually) |
| 05:08 | <zewt> | (the flash one stops after 30s read-ahead and stays stopped indefinitely) |
| 05:10 | <zewt> | (the html5 one working is what I expected--i suppose you could probably jump the hoops to cripple prebuffering like that with <video> if you wanted to badly enough, though) |
| 06:47 | <MikeSmith> | has anybody written tests for CSS animations? |
| 06:48 | MikeSmith | finds http://test.csswg.org/source/contributors/microsoft/incoming/CSS3/animations/ |
| 07:48 | <matjas> | lol @ XHTML 1.0 Strict |
| 07:49 | <odinho> | Yes, could do that once every day. |
| 10:28 | <SimonSapin> | border-collapse with colspan/rowspan is "funny" ... http://dabblet.com/gist/3082417 (compare webkit and gecko) |
| 10:29 | <zcorpan> | firefox 16 will be the unprefixing release, huh? |
| 10:30 | <Ms2ger> | Yeah |
| 10:30 | <zcorpan> | SimonSapin: opera has a third rendering :-) |
| 10:30 | Ms2ger | looks for other things to unprefix |
| 10:30 | <SimonSapin> | zcorpan: yes, I just checked |
| 10:30 | <zcorpan> | SimonSapin: what's correct per spec? does it say? |
| 10:31 | <SimonSapin> | the spec doesn’t say anything … |
| 10:31 | <Ms2ger> | zcorpan, Ha. Ha. Ha. |
| 10:31 | <SimonSapin> | I’ll just do whatever is more convenient in WeasyPrint |
| 10:32 | <zcorpan> | anyone have ie to check? |
| 10:32 | <zcorpan> | i bet it has its own take on it |
| 10:32 | <SimonSapin> | I don’t even what to bother reporting this to www-style, nothing’s gonna happen until someone makes css3-tables in a few decades |
| 10:33 | <zcorpan> | would be nice to have issues documented somewhere though when that someone wants to take it |
| 10:34 | <zcorpan> | maybe a wiki page is better than emails to www-style |
| 10:36 | <SimonSapin> | I think that CSSWG has both a wiki and a bugzilla for tracking issues |
| 10:37 | <zcorpan> | heycam|away: shouldn't webidl drop the "must have a length" if ES already requires length to be present? |
| 10:46 | <Ms2ger> | SimonSapin, and Tracker |
| 10:47 | <SimonSapin> | Ms2ger: indeed |
| 10:48 | <Ms2ger> | Might be useful to ask MikeSmith to create a bugzilla component for tabkes |
| 10:48 | <Ms2ger> | tables* |
| 10:51 | <SimonSapin> | Ms2ger: wrote about this to www-style, I’ll leave the rest to the WG |
| 11:51 | <MikeSmith> | Ms2ger: CSS tables? |
| 11:54 | <MikeSmith> | btw, I added a bunch of CSS features to http://platform.html5.org/ |
| 11:54 | <MikeSmith> | lots more green flags there now |
| 12:01 | <zcorpan> | i love how http://html5please.com/#WebSockets recommends disabling websocket for safari but at the same time using Flash Sockets |
| 12:02 | <AryehGregor> | Is there really no Array.remove() or something in JS? |
| 12:02 | <AryehGregor> | arr.splice(i, 1) seems a bit abstruse compared to arr.remove(i) or such. |
| 13:18 | <kennyluck> | CSS Undefined Module |
| 13:19 | <Ms2ger> | Do you mean CSS 2.1? |
| 13:31 | <kennyluck> | yeah :) |
| 14:32 | <zcorpan> | what's the procedure of publishing a Final Specification? |
| 14:35 | <Ms2ger> | Sacrifice a goat |
| 14:36 | <zcorpan> | :-( |
| 14:36 | <zewt> | declare the spec dead? |
| 14:37 | <zcorpan> | i thought it was possible to publish Final Specifications several times |
| 14:37 | <zewt> | i thought that was just Final Fantasy |
| 14:37 | <Ms2ger> | I think that's the idea |
| 14:37 | <Ms2ger> | Maybe AryehGregor knows |
| 14:38 | <AryehGregor> | Yes, that's my understanding. |
| 14:38 | <AryehGregor> | A Final Specification is a frozen snapshot. |
| 14:38 | <AryehGregor> | But a CG can publish however many it wants. |
| 14:38 | <AryehGregor> | And/or continue work on the specs after forking them. |
| 14:38 | <AryehGregor> | I imagine the procedure for publishing a Final Specification is "Talk to Ian Jacobs, he'll be very excited because no one's done it yet". |
| 14:39 | <zcorpan> | should whatcg publish FSs for all the drafts (and one for html)? |
| 14:39 | <zcorpan> | i see whatcg doesn't list html under current drafts |
| 14:39 | <zcorpan> | but i thought the purpose was to publish html as FS at some point |
| 14:40 | <Ms2ger> | The purpose was the patent policy |
| 14:40 | <Ms2ger> | And I thought that happened earlier than FS |
| 14:44 | <zcorpan> | well we haven't published a draft either so i guess the CLA doesn't apply for html yet |
| 14:44 | <zcorpan> | i haven't read the CLA and FSA in detail yet |
| 14:50 | <zcorpan> | http://www.w3.org/community/reports/reqs/ copyright boilerplate for FS says to link to https://www.w3.org/community/about/agreements/fsa/ but that redirects to fsa-deed, i guess final/ was intended |
| 14:52 | <zcorpan> | also uses https on some links but they seem to redirect to http |
| 14:54 | zcorpan | sends an email |
| 15:20 | <zcorpan> | fast ij is fast |
| 15:33 | <AryehGregor> | Ms2ger, the patent policy before FS only applies to contributors, I think. At FS, everyone is invited to agree to license their patents on the subject matter, although it's optional. (I think.) |
| 15:33 | <AryehGregor> | I guess I should publish a FS of the editing spec. |
| 15:34 | <AryehGregor> | But if the WHATCG wants to test the waters first, please be my guest. :) |
| 17:44 | <matjas> | annevk: re: HTTP & data URLs & same-origin: http://dvcs.w3.org/hg/xhr/raw-file/tip/Overview.html#data:-urls-and-http seems to allow it |
| 17:44 | <matjas> | annevk: couldn’t find it in the HTML spec |
| 17:45 | <matjas> | annevk: or did I misunderstand that section ^? |
| 17:50 | <quinnirill> | hey everyone, I have a question about the XHR2 |
| 17:51 | <quinnirill> | is Anne here? |
| 17:51 | <zewt> | that's an easy question, nope |
| 17:51 | <quinnirill> | hehe |
| 17:51 | <quinnirill> | ok, I'll try again later then, thanks |
| 17:51 | <TabAtkins_> | Anne's on vacation, except when he checks in. |
| 17:51 | <quinnirill> | ahh |
| 17:52 | <quinnirill> | hmm, I'll just drop this in to boil now then |
| 17:53 | <quinnirill> | it looks to me like the current spec doesn't have any support for streaming, am I correct? has this been discussed? |
| 17:57 | <quinnirill> | the thing is, we're building these JS audio decoders and *not* streaming would be horrible UX as potential use cases can include 1h+ songs and even for 3m+ songs downloading the whole song before starting playback is usually unacceptable |
| 17:57 | <quinnirill> | so for now, we're using partial requests, but that's hogging bandwidth like a... well, hog. |
| 17:58 | <quinnirill> | I was wondering if there's a better solution cooking and whether we could maybe contribute ideas |
| 17:59 | <zewt> | iirc you can access arraybuffer while loading to get the data so far (never tried it/don't know if it's implemented/might be wrong) |
| 17:59 | <zewt> | don't think that lets you actually stream (eg. discard data as you read to read an unbounded stream) |
| 18:00 | <quinnirill> | zewt: ok, I'll try that and see if it would be good enough, thanks! |
| 18:17 | <Hixie> | i don't suppose we can just drop xslt support from the platform? |
| 18:18 | <TabAtkins_> | I'm cool with this. |
| 18:18 | Hixie | stares at hsivonen's scary-looking feedback regarding how readyState should work with xslt |
| 18:20 | <Hixie> | oh hey, i already have a section that basically says "i give up on xslt, but in the absence of xslt defining this stuff, here's some handwaving suggestions" |
| 18:20 | Hixie | adds more to it |
| 19:27 | <zewt> | gar does google really not index w3 tickets |
| 19:27 | <zewt> | site:https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/ 1 result |
| 19:32 | <TabAtkins_> | view-source:https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/robots.txt |
| 19:32 | <TabAtkins_> | So, no. |
| 19:32 | <zewt> | (obviously, the real question was "why does w3's tracker have a completely BS robots.txt") |
| 19:33 | <zewt> | that's beyond absurd ... even for the w3c |
| 19:38 | <gsnedders> | jwalden: __proto__ is in Carakan! |
| 19:44 | <jwalden> | yay! |
| 19:46 | <Hixie> | zewt: bugzilla in general disables robots because of load, iirc |
| 19:46 | <Hixie> | also the real robots.txt that matters is https://www.w3.org/robots.txt |
| 19:46 | <Velmont> | They should learn it some caching :-) |
| 19:47 | <Hixie> | (a robots.txt in a subdirectory doesn't work) |
| 19:47 | <Velmont> | Do some varnish magic. |
| 19:54 | <jarek> | which spec should I be looking at to get the list of all possible color names? |
| 19:54 | <gsnedders> | css3-color |
| 19:54 | <jarek> | SVG? CSS2.1? CSS3 Color module? |
| 19:55 | <jarek> | http://www.w3.org/TR/css3-iccprof |
| 19:55 | <jarek> | but it's from 2001 :/ |
| 19:55 | <gsnedders> | http://www.w3.org/TR/css3-color/ is a REC from last year |
| 19:55 | <jarek> | cool, thanks |
| 19:55 | <TabAtkins_> | jarek: If you want to use the list for something, I have a few versions of the list in JSON. |
| 19:56 | <jarek> | TabAtkins_: I need a list of all color names that could be used with "fill" SVG property |
| 19:57 | <jarek> | TabAtkins_: how many colors are on your list? 147? |
| 19:57 | <TabAtkins_> | In browsers, 'fill' takes every single CSS color, including ones that SVG doesn't officially define. |
| 19:57 | <TabAtkins_> | All of which are defined in css3-color, that gsnedders linked to. |
| 20:00 | <jarek> | TabAtkins_: css3-color seems to contains exactly the same colors as SVG 1.1 |
| 20:00 | <TabAtkins_> | Yes. |
| 20:00 | <TabAtkins_> | The colors haven't changed for a decade. |
| 20:02 | <jarek> | there is gray and gray which are basically the same color :/ |
| 20:03 | <jarek> | I mean gray and grey |
| 20:05 | <TabAtkins_> | Yes, they're identical. The named colors list is *retarded*. |
| 20:05 | <jarek> | I assume that decision to include both gray and grey on the list was purely political? |
| 20:06 | <Hixie> | probably dates back to X11 |
| 20:09 | <jarek> | I didn't know that X11 was designed by a committee |
| 20:10 | <jarek> | it looks more like addition from W3C |
| 20:10 | <gsnedders> | Totally backwards compatible, most of it never used. |
| 20:10 | <TabAtkins_> | Not political. The X11 list was copied from an old rgb.txt file that someone had. |
| 20:10 | <TabAtkins_> | Someone on that Linux distro decided that that particular list was worthwhile. |
| 20:10 | <TabAtkins_> | I respectfully submit that that distro maintainer was stupid. |
| 20:11 | <Hixie> | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/X11_color_names suggests it's even more complicated than i feared |
| 20:12 | <Hixie> | looks like netscape was on the path of blame |
| 20:15 | <jarek> | "Some browsers like Netscape navigator insisted on an ‘a’ in any ‘Gray’ except for ‘Light Grey’." |
| 20:16 | <gavinc> | I this mess starts in the 19th century :P |
| 20:16 | <gavinc> | http://grammarist.com/spelling/gray-grey/ |
| 20:18 | <gsnedders> | There's 50 Shades of Grey, but only 1 Shade of Gray. |
| 22:28 | <hober> | It's that time of year again when I post in some WBS surveys and see if anyone cares enough to fill them out. |
| 22:28 | <hober> | Specifically, https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/40318/issue-200-objection-poll/ and https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/40318/issue-189-objection-poll/ |
| 22:37 | <zewt> | TabAtkins_: WS post might have mixed up quotees a little |
| 22:40 | <zewt> | were there two threads about that same topic? could have sworn I replied to this already |
| 22:43 | <zewt> | must have been a discard |