| 04:10 | <Yuhong> | http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-html/2001Mar/0023.html |
| 04:11 | <Yuhong> | about document.all and document.getElementById |
| 04:11 | <Yuhong> | from 2001 before IE6 was released by Hixie. |
| 04:12 | <Yuhong> | from 2001 before IE6 was released, by Hixie. |
| 04:37 | <jackjack> | Hello, everyone! |
| 04:38 | <jackjack> | is there anyone who is familiar with HTML tokenization states? |
| 04:39 | <jackjack> | I need a little help |
| 04:39 | <jackjack> | Thanks! |
| 04:44 | <espadrine`> | jackjack: do you have a question? |
| 04:45 | <jackjack> | Yes, as mentioned by HTML standards: " In some cases, the tokenizer state is also changed by the tree construction stage. |
| 04:45 | <jackjack> | " |
| 04:46 | <jackjack> | I am wondering what are the "some cases"? |
| 04:48 | <jackjack> | "The exact behavior of certain states depends on the insertion mode and the stack of open elements." |
| 04:50 | <jackjack> | What are those "certain states" ? |
| 04:50 | <jackjack> | Anyone can help me ? |
| 04:52 | <espadrine`> | I would assume that this has to do with document.write, but I cannot assert that for sure |
| 04:54 | <espadrine`> | although it's bad to use document.write |
| 04:55 | <espadrine`> | cats die when you do that |
| 05:58 | <SimonSapin> | Tabatkins: Looking at your new CSS parser now. Do you exepect to have JS tests for it? How would these relate to a test suite for the spec? |
| 06:41 | <jwalden> | gsnedders: the yak-shaving and the __proto__ patch test out and are posted for review now! |
| 06:41 | <jwalden> | \o/ \o/ \o/ \o/ |
| 06:42 | <jwalden> | https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=773850 and https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=770344 if you care |
| 06:44 | <espadrine`> | yay for __proto__! |
| 06:44 | <espadrine`> | not sure what yak-shaving does though |
| 07:18 | <jwalden> | boo for __proto__ |
| 07:18 | <jwalden> | but yay for its being implemented sanely, if it must be implemented at all |
| 07:19 | <jwalden> | the yak-shaving was some API cleanup/improvement over what we had before, which was thoroughly bizarre and unreadable |
| 07:39 | <annevk> | jackjack: <plaintext>, <script>, and such cause the tokenizer to change from the parser |
| 07:40 | <annevk> | jackjack: espadrine: document.write() just injects into the character stream, it does not actually change state (although the characters it injects could of course) |
| 08:08 | <rniwa> | annevk: not sure if you've read my rant about htmlcollection but can we somehow name HTML*Collection::namedItem saner? |
| 08:08 | <rniwa> | annevk: as is, it's implementation/API nightmare. |
| 08:08 | <rniwa> | somehow make* |
| 08:10 | <Ms2ger> | "<Yuhong> from 2001 before IE6 was released by Hixie." |
| 08:10 | Ms2ger | didn't read that as intended |
| 08:11 | <annevk> | how was that intended? |
| 08:12 | <Ms2ger> | A comma after "released" |
| 08:12 | <annevk> | rniwa: I recommend filing a bug on Gecko and Opera to see if they agree to implement saner behavior |
| 08:12 | <rniwa> | annevk: i don't think neither Gecko nor Opera implements what the spec says. |
| 08:12 | <Ms2ger> | rniwa, and test if we don't do that already :) |
| 08:12 | <annevk> | rniwa: if Hixie disagrees the simplest approach is to convince the other vendors of your right |
| 08:13 | <rniwa> | annevk: hixie mention that there are some comat. issues :\ |
| 08:13 | <rniwa> | mentions* |
| 08:13 | <annevk> | rniwa: no he presumes there are |
| 08:14 | <rniwa> | annevk: hm... maybe i should try that then. |
| 08:14 | <annevk> | there might be compat issues and the people that can tell you are the other vendors |
| 08:15 | <annevk> | but sometimes e.g. Gecko is willing to take a small short term hit for long term API improvements |
| 08:25 | <rniwa> | annevk: yeah, Mozilla is good at that. |
| 08:25 | <rniwa> | annevk: wish we could do the same in WebKit :\ |
| 08:25 | <rniwa> | annevk: but we have some constraints :( |
| 08:25 | <annevk> | you can in Chromium ;) |
| 08:26 | <rniwa> | annevk: oh well, we try not to diverse too much between ports |
| 08:26 | <rniwa> | annevk: we don't want to end up with 4-5 different flavors of webkit :) |
| 08:27 | <rniwa> | annevk: arguably, we're more liberal about changing web-facing APIs than other ports but still. |
| 08:29 | <Ms2ger> | And here I thought you already had ended up with 4-5 different flavours of webkit :) |
| 08:30 | <rniwa> | Ms2ger: noooo. don't point out the painful fact. |
| 08:30 | <Ms2ger> | :D |
| 08:31 | <rniwa> | Ms2ger: ironically, i use firefox on my android tablet because that's the only browser available on my ICS tablet that reliably lets me review/comment on bugs.webkit.org |
| 08:32 | <Ms2ger> | Yw ;) |
| 08:32 | <Ms2ger> | Now, what do you think about Chrome-on-Gecko? :) |
| 08:33 | <rniwa> | Ms2ger: you mean chrome inside BtG? |
| 08:33 | <rniwa> | BtoG* |
| 08:34 | <rniwa> | or was it B2G? |
| 08:34 | <espadrine> | rniwa: Firefox OS now |
| 08:34 | <rniwa> | espadrine: oh, that's right. |
| 08:34 | <rniwa> | espadrine, Ms2ger: so you want Chrome on Firefox OS? |
| 08:34 | <Ms2ger> | No, I want Chrome to get rid of webkit and use Gecko instead :) |
| 08:34 | <rniwa> | Ms2ger: oh... not sure about that. |
| 08:35 | <rniwa> | Ms2ger: you guys don't support multi process model still :\ |
| 08:35 | <rniwa> | Ms2ger: and don't support all those webkit extensions. |
| 08:35 | <rniwa> | Ms2ger: anyway, i think it's nice to have competition between different browser engines |
| 08:35 | <Ms2ger> | That's coming soon enough |
| 08:35 | <rniwa> | Ms2ger: maybe we'll consider once you've removed all the comments in your code :) |
| 08:36 | <Ms2ger> | Hah |
| 08:36 | <Ms2ger> | To make it look more like webkit? :) |
| 08:36 | <rniwa> | Ms2ger: http://lists.webkit.org/pipermail/webkit-dev/2012-July/thread.html |
| 08:37 | Ms2ger | snorts |
| 08:37 | <Ms2ger> | Hey, if you join us, you don't need to write ChangeLog entries ;) |
| 08:38 | <espadrine> | although you will need to struggle with mercurial queues |
| 08:39 | <rniwa> | Ms2ger: no, i love change logs :) |
| 08:39 | <rniwa> | espadrine: must use svn ;) |
| 08:39 | <Ms2ger> | Shrug, MQ is nice |
| 08:40 | <espadrine> | ouch. svn. I thought webkit people all used git as an svn front-end |
| 08:40 | <rniwa> | espadrine: no. |
| 08:40 | <rniwa> | espadrine: i actually prefer svn over git |
| 08:40 | <rniwa> | espadrine: git is way too complicated for my work flow |
| 08:41 | <rniwa> | espadrine, Ms2ger: if i do join mozilla, you'll find out how "unconventional" and how unhip i am :) |
| 08:41 | <Ms2ger> | rniwa, we hate git too ;) |
| 08:41 | <Ms2ger> | Except the a-team and webdev |
| 08:42 | <rniwa> | Ms2ger: http://lists.webkit.org/pipermail/webkit-dev/2012-March/019808.html for your enjoyment |
| 08:42 | <rniwa> | or http://lists.webkit.org/pipermail/webkit-dev/2012-March/thread.html |
| 08:42 | <Ms2ger> | WebKittens? |
| 08:42 | <rniwa> | yeah |
| 08:43 | <espadrine> | one day we'll all have to move to git anyway |
| 08:43 | <espadrine> | Servo is handled by git :) |
| 08:44 | <rniwa> | espadrine: i'm not convinced. |
| 08:44 | <espadrine> | rniwa: don't worry, I won't make the elevator pitch. |
| 08:45 | <rniwa> | anyway, i have a serious problem with people who advocate for one-fits-all solution. |
| 08:47 | <rniwa> | they irritate me to no end |
| 08:47 | <rniwa> | just like people who jokingly talk about everything would have been easy if we all spoke English, etc... |
| 08:48 | <Ms2ger> | Imagine how many would speak en-AU then |
| 08:52 | <rniwa> | Ms2ger: I had a Scottish English teacher who lied in Ireland for years. |
| 08:53 | <rniwa> | lived* |
| 08:53 | <Ms2ger> | The original was more fascinating |
| 08:53 | Ms2ger | imagines an obsessive liar in a kilt |
| 08:53 | <Ms2ger> | ... walking through the Irish countryside |
| 08:54 | <rniwa> | hehehe |
| 08:55 | <rniwa> | Ms2ger: actually, Dublin is the only city in Europe i've been to. |
| 08:55 | rniwa | is excited about TPAC in Lyon :) |
| 08:55 | <Ms2ger> | For the beer? :) |
| 08:55 | <rniwa> | Ms2ger: i was 17 at the time |
| 08:55 | <rniwa> | Ms2ger: so no beer for me. |
| 08:55 | <Ms2ger> | I see |
| 08:56 | Ms2ger | is never excited about TPAC |
| 08:58 | <volkmar> | Hixie: for the autocompletetype, my opinion (and bz when we talked) is that it is a very bad idea and we can solve that we current input types |
| 08:58 | <volkmar> | I've never found time to reply though, still in my todo list |
| 09:00 | <espadrine> | volkmar: you mean, by having a better "name=" de-facto standard? |
| 12:45 | <gsnedders> | Exciting times in ES land, trying to subvert what some people want… |
| 13:32 | <annevk> | gsnedders: isn't that what usually happens? :) |
| 13:37 | <gsnedders> | annevk: No, not in ES land. |
| 13:38 | <annevk> | ES4? |
| 13:39 | <gsnedders> | Well, that wasn't so much subvertion as just outright refusal to implement something they'd never been involved in. But I was really meaning Harmony onwards. |
| 13:45 | <annevk> | gsnedders: so what's going on? |
| 13:46 | <gsnedders> | __proto__, and whether it should be an accessor property or not. |
| 13:54 | <annevk> | I should invest time in learning JavaScript again at some point |
| 13:59 | <annevk> | Ms2ger: re the addendum stuff, writing time != publication time |
| 14:00 | <annevk> | e.g. Linköping story was well over a year old |
| 14:00 | <annevk> | the /\ |
| 18:25 | <zewt> | grr no onerror for <link rel=stylesheet> on ios |
| 18:27 | <zewt> | at least <script defer> works |
| 18:30 | <zewt> | no onerror, yet onload works |
| 18:30 | <zewt> | guess i might be able to fudge it with that |
| 18:31 | <zewt> | wait, it doesn't work; oh well |
| 19:50 | <Hixie> | volkmar: please make sure to reply on the list soon, because right now all the feedback is positive and i'm ready to spec it |
| 20:00 | <Yuhong> | BTW, it is unfortunate that it took until just after Gecko introduced Almost Standards Mode before the first draft of CSS 2.1 was introduced. |
| 20:02 | <Yuhong> | *published. |
| 20:12 | <jackjack> | annevk: espadrine': thanks for answering my question. |
| 22:04 | <divya> | annevk: YOU MADE IT TI W3C MEMESS |
| 22:53 | <annevk> | divya: hahaha |