02:46
<MikeSmith>
expected better than that from Bruno Haible
02:48
<MikeSmith>
side note: I’m trying to imagine how much worse that bug-tracking tool could be in terms of usability
02:50
<MikeSmith>
I gues that’s one more way the GNU Project is contributing to the greater good: Their Web-based systems are so consistently horrible and user-hostile that they make everybody else’s bad systems seem tolerable
03:39
<MikeSmith>
just when you thought there’s no way the “The is="" attribute is confusing? Maybe we should encourage only ES6 class-based extension” issue discussion could get any worse, csuwildcat shows up https://github.com/w3c/webcomponents/issues/509#issuecomment-280864156
03:40
<MikeSmith>
somebody should lock that conversation
05:57
<annevk>
gsnedders: UTR #22 is best ignored though
06:21
<MikeSmith>
annevk: what should be referenced instead of UTR #22?
06:24
<MikeSmith>
https://encoding.spec.whatwg.org/#concept-encoding-get I guess
06:26
<annevk>
MikeSmith: yup
06:27
<annevk>
MikeSmith: treating shift-jis as shift_jis breaks sites for instance
06:27
<MikeSmith>
oh
06:49
<MikeSmith>
gsnedders: point out to Bruno that groff also uses “utf8” https://www.haible.de/bruno/packages-groff-utf8.html
08:03
<annevk>
The reason "utf8" works in Encoding is because we made it a label for "utf-8"
08:03
<annevk>
Not all browsers accepted that though until recently, Edge didn't for instance
10:04
<annevk>
mkwst_: could you comment on https://github.com/whatwg/html/pull/2365?
10:27
<mkwst_>
annevk: Commented, thanks for the ping.
10:32
<annevk>
mkwst_: thanks, I think per that answer I'm going to close your URL PR for this and also resolve the URL legacy bug stating we need to do something here
10:32
<annevk>
mkwst_: providing forward pointers to this PR
10:32
<mkwst_>
That sounds fine. I think we might want to move it in the future, but I'm happy to wait until we have a reason to do so.
10:53
<Ms2ger>
Funny how we had whining about for-const-of for a week, and it was removed within two days
10:54
<gsnedders>
annevk: but then you get into the whole discussion as to whether that is a standard, and UTRs seemed less of a risk for that
10:54
<annevk>
gsnedders: if you want to hand out wrong advice, be my guest
10:55
<annevk>
Ms2ger: not sure I'd qualify it as whining and nothing really got resolved so you'll continue to encounter this
10:55
<gsnedders>
annevk: also there's the question as to whether Encoding will ever get adoption outside of the web space
10:57
<Ms2ger>
Okay, maybe not whining... How do you feel about "being an antisocial jackass"?
10:57
<annevk>
Ms2ger: I think you're pretty close to violating the CoC
10:58
<annevk>
gsnedders: I think Go uses it, but maybe that still counts as web
10:59
<gsnedders>
annevk: success in that sense would be ICU, Win32, macOS's APIs adopting it, IMO
10:59
<gsnedders>
annevk: and I don't think there's been any indication that there's even a vague intention of?
11:00
<annevk>
gsnedders: Chrome might have discussed upstreaming to ICU, but I doubt ICU would start removing stuff, indeed
11:00
<annevk>
gsnedders: those platforms have obvious legacy too, the question is what new platforms will do
11:07
<gsnedders>
annevk: the problem, when almost nothing outside of browsers has any planned intention to support it, is that it's easy to dismiss as a web-specific thing
11:07
<gsnedders>
annevk: hell, non-web stuff may well rely on more encodings and different alias matching
11:08
<annevk>
gsnedders: and different decoding and encoding rules? Could be, but the web is bigger than all those places and more easily leaks into them than the other way around
11:09
<annevk>
gsnedders: actually, as for new platforms, they should probably stick to UTF-8
11:10
<annevk>
gsnedders: any more thoughts on https://github.com/whatwg/url/issues/233 btw while you're here?
12:25
<annevk>
jgraham: created a fairly minimal PR for raw_headers
12:49
<jgraham>
annevk: Thanks!
13:02
<annevk>
jgraham: I want to checkout an old branch on WPT and I get "The following untracked working tree files would be overwritten by checkout"
13:02
<annevk>
jgraham: followed by a bunch of tools/ stuff
13:04
<annevk>
Ah, git checkout -f
13:20
<annevk>
jgraham: when will the new wptserve be used by WPT?
13:20
<jgraham>
annevk: When I update the submodule pointer
13:20
<jgraham>
Just looking at another review first
13:33
<jgraham>
annevk: Done
15:04
<annevk>
I wish I had not neglected WPT for so long and hope somebody else would take care of it 😟
15:04
<annevk>
That strategy never works
15:04
<jgraham>
?
15:04
<annevk>
jgraham: going through various labels of standards I edit and feeling bad
15:04
<annevk>
jgraham: currently cleaning up the XMLHttpRequest backlog
15:04
<jgraham>
Ah, yeah
15:04
<jgraham>
Getting people to review tests is hard
15:09
<JonathanNeal>
What was the motivation behind sectioning roots? And how were the elements defined as sectioning roots determined? https://developers.whatwg.org/sections.html#sectioning-root
15:36
<wanderview>
JakeA: annevk: so, uh... are we moving ahead on the fetch cancelation thing? what is the next step?
15:36
<JakeA>
wanderview: I guess we need to design the APIs
15:36
<annevk>
wanderview: I'm kinda hoping JakeA will take the lead
15:36
<JakeA>
It's on my TODO list to circle back on that
15:37
<JakeA>
I guess I should give it some priority
15:37
<wanderview>
I feel like its something we should ship in 2017 if we can
15:37
<annevk>
I've mostly been fixing bugs URL/Fetch/XMLHttpRequest and their tests, and also some HTML work
15:37
<JakeA>
Let me spend tomorrow on it
15:37
wanderview
notes JakeA will solve fetch cancellation tomorrow.
15:37
wanderview
goes to tweet...
15:37
<JakeA>
haha
15:37
<wanderview>
j/k
15:37
<annevk>
Let's see, two weeks from now I should be able to help out more
15:38
<annevk>
I'd like to get WPT more into shape this week and next week I've some meetings
15:39
<wanderview>
I need to write a WPT test, but can't decide where to put it
15:39
<wanderview>
need to test referrer header on fetch/xhr from worker script when the worker script was redirected
15:39
<wanderview>
does that go in fetch, workers, or some security dir?
15:42
<annevk>
wanderview: fetch/ seems fine
15:42
<annevk>
wanderview: fetch/ has lots of worker tests already
15:42
<wanderview>
well, referrer-policy/generic tests are disabled currently
15:42
<annevk>
wanderview: and some referrer tests as it has referrer features
15:43
<annevk>
wanderview: in fetch/ or in Gecko?
15:43
<wanderview>
claims because of https://github.com/w3c/web-platform-tests/issues/1874
15:43
<wanderview>
which was fixed 1.5 years ago
15:43
<wanderview>
maybe we can turn them back on
15:43
wanderview
sighs
15:44
<wanderview>
I guess thats just a subset of tests
16:28
<annevk>
Domenic: how does IDB work?
16:51
<zcorpan>
annevk: LOL I tried to review the PR review PR for quirks, and only noticed after merging that the source file is not named quirks.bs
16:51
<zcorpan>
annevk: but maybe we can rename it to that
16:54
<zcorpan>
annevk: does that need a change to .htaccess or something?
16:55
<annevk>
zcorpan: we can change the name in pr-preview too
16:56
<annevk>
zcorpan: not sure why .htaccess needs changes
16:57
<annevk>
zcorpan: tobie can maybe help, bit busy atm
16:57
<zcorpan>
annevk: I thought there was a DirectoryIndex Overview.html
16:58
<zcorpan>
I can look at this again tomorrow.
16:59
<tobie>
zcorpan: that's fine. Just edit the config file.
17:00
<zcorpan>
tobie: thx
17:02
<annevk>
zcorpan: I cleaned that up already
17:02
<annevk>
zcorpan: Travis generates index.html resources
17:05
<gsnedders>
hsivonen: if you're about at all, I'd be curious to hear your opinion on what level HTML sanitizers should work; rubys' (IIRC) Python one in html5lib originally worked by intercepting tokens between the tokenizer and the tree constructor, but that seems fragile. Seems better to post-process the tree, IMO?
17:07
<wanderview>
oh, I guess we fixed the spelling of referer with referrer-policy
17:11
<wanderview>
the referrer-policy tests are kind of hard to understand...
17:11
<gsnedders>
that's confusing
17:13
<annevk>
gsnedders: post-process on tree, how does that work with scripts?
17:13
<gsnedders>
annevk: does any sanitizer execute scripts or do anything but strip them?
17:14
<wanderview>
annevk: if there is a referrer-policy on the top level worker script, but also a different referrer-policy on an importScripts() script... which policy should the worker have at the end?
17:14
<annevk>
gsnedders: dunno, but worth thinking about since people keep asking for browsers to solve
17:15
<annevk>
wanderview: worker has top-level
17:15
<gsnedders>
annevk: if you're sanitizing something, surely you have to treat it as totally untrusted which means you must not execute scripts
17:15
<wanderview>
annevk: meaning only the header on the top level worker script should apply?
17:15
<annevk>
wanderview: yeah
17:16
<wanderview>
annevk: I'll write a test for that... since we don't do that right
17:16
<annevk>
wanderview: you cannot update the global policy through importScripting a resource with diff policy
17:16
<annevk>
wanderview: wow
17:16
<annevk>
And thanks
17:17
<wanderview>
annevk: all of this is a mess
17:17
<wanderview>
in gecko
17:17
<wanderview>
annevk: I regressed referrer on redirected worker scripts because we don't have tests for that... fixing in https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1340652
17:17
<wanderview>
and just noticing other broken referrer stuff in workers
17:18
<annevk>
gsnedders: maybe not nonce scripts, but I was more thinking they might have executed by the time you propose to remove them
17:18
<annevk>
wanderview: appreciate you going down the rabbit hole
17:19
<annevk>
wanderview: try to follow such a policy myself too
17:21
<wanderview>
we have a lot of disabled referrer-policy tests as well: https://dxr.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/search?q=disabled+path%3Aweb-platform%2Fmeta%2Freferrer-policy&redirect=false
17:38
<annevk>
wanderview: stumbled across https://github.com/w3c/web-platform-tests/issues/2618