14:46
<mikedidomizio>

Hey everyone,

I've been waiting to hear from mfreed and ntim regarding their thoughts on the <details> element, specifically how it works with ontoggle and the open attribute, but haven't seen any updates from them since my initial post.

At work we're potentially planning on modifying its behaviour (specifically we're considering preventing ontoggle from automatically firing if the open attribute is present) through a React component built on top of the <details> element.
After discussing this with my team, it became clear that the current behaviour isn't intuitive for most developers, and this leaves a chance of introducing more bugs into our code base (a bug is what started this all).
While I respect the WHATWG's decision on how they think things should work, if modifying behaviour prevents the likelihood of bugs in the codebase, and misunderstandings within my team, I’m willing to implement a change. That’s why we’re opting for a custom implementation to change how it works.

I'm still very interested in the reasoning behind the current design choices, and if this is something that should be revisited. A part of me wonders if I'm overthinking this, but I also worry how many devs in the future may misunderstand the behaviour of the <details> element, given how the ontoggle event handler works differently than how most (all?) other event handlers work.

I noticed you guys have a few meetings, I'm not sure if that's the correct place for you to discuss further, or for me to DM the folks mentioned above, or we continue to wait for them.

Thanks and let me know if there's anything I can do to help.

17:16
<Domenic>
Where are the queue / minutes for the current meeting being maintained?
17:18
<Domenic>
(answer: #css in W3C IRC)
17:40
<hacknorris>
bad idea but i thought of adding "ascii" attribute to html img tag so non-blind terminal users could see image…
maybe also a tag for 3d graphics with uv map and src attributes…
20:51
<Panos Astithas>
Hey all, are people on board to continue the WHATWG discussion for https://github.com/openui/open-ui/issues/1088 between 2-4 in the same room?
20:51
<Panos Astithas>
Room is Concourse Level - Laguna
21:17
<Panos Astithas>
annevk, smaug : ^^
21:17
<annevk>
Panos Astithas: we're both in Web Performance at the moment
21:18
<annevk>
I can come, but I need to come from -1
21:18
<annevk>
So give me 5 minutes?
21:19
<smaug>
(I wasn't aware of that meeting and I think I should be here)
21:19
<smaug>
Panos Astithas: ^
21:20
<Panos Astithas>
Yeah, it was a last minute rush, apologies
21:21
<Panos Astithas>
FYI, we'll talk about Sanket's popovertarget for custom elements and Keith's rich inputs
23:36
<Panos Astithas>
Meeting notes doc for the WHATWG-only session: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1_NLRCWYfYenAYPVP_PyQD6klqxU4jNZJm9FM1XRSlAU/edit
23:43
<annevk>
Is smaug here? We're talking about moveBefore()
23:43
<annevk>
Oh doh.
23:43
<smaug>
Panos Astithas: is there supposed to be a zoom session for this?
23:45
<krosylight>
4 people are just waiting on zoom
23:45
<krosylight>
(as https://www.w3.org/events/meetings/d2094f4c-5e77-4b4d-b2b7-d9ff0a1de4bb/ lists zoom)
23:46
<Panos Astithas>
Oops!
23:46
<Panos Astithas>
Apologies, I just started the video
23:48
<krosylight>
is there meeting notes somewhere?
23:48
<Domenic>
A few messages up
23:48
<krosylight>
ah just above
23:49
<annevk>
krosylight: are you in Berlin still? That's way past my bedtime 😅
23:49
<krosylight>
mine too 😅 but what can I do
23:50
<Panos Astithas>
Sleep is overrated :-)
23:50
<Panos Astithas>
(not really, no)