| 00:14 | <Hixie> | anyone have an opinion on whether pushState() should take an absolute URI which the UA must then verify, or whether we should require that it be frefixed either with ? or with # and that it then replaces either the query part or the hash part? |
| 00:17 | <othermaciej> | Hixie: I think it should accept either relative or absolute and apply appropriate constraints to the resulting resolved URI |
| 00:17 | <othermaciej> | Hixie: a lot of "REST" style sites put the interesting info in path segments of the URI, not in a query or fragment ID |
| 00:18 | <Hixie> | we could allow the path part to change too, i guess |
| 00:19 | <Hixie> | so you're saying take the URI, resolve it relative to whatever it is you resolve URIs in scripts to, and then check the protocol/server/port are the same |
| 00:20 | <othermaciej> | yes, that would be my suggestion |
| 00:20 | <Hixie> | k |
| 00:21 | <Hixie> | sweet, my ilife '08 package arrived |
| 00:21 | <Hixie> | now go go el wire package! |
| 00:34 | kingryan | finds it interesting that http://www.whatwg.org/specs/web-apps/current-work/#outlines includes actual code |
| 01:11 | <Hixie> | hm |
| 01:11 | <Hixie> | an event to inform people that the fragment identifier has changed |
| 01:12 | <Hixie> | on...hashchanged? |
| 01:17 | <kingryan> | isn't there already an event for that? |
| 01:17 | <kingryan> | or maybe its just onscroll that gets emitted |
| 01:21 | <Hixie> | i don't think there's an event other than onscroll, no |
| 01:21 | <Hixie> | and onscroll doesn't always fire |
| 01:25 | <kingryan> | right |
| 02:47 | <deltab> | Hixie: would it be when navigation starts, or when the target fragment is shown? |
| 03:22 | <Hixie> | deltab: it fires when you're on a page and you do something to scroll the page to a new fragid |
| 04:08 | <mpt> | Hixie, how about when you load a page with a fragment in the first place? |
| 04:09 | <mpt> | ah, maybe that's already catered for |
| 12:08 | <annevk> | Hixie, http://annevankesteren.nl/2007/08/ajax-history people ask for replaceState() |
| 12:09 | <Philip`> | Hixie: About the parser performance data: I got significant speedups by measuring the expected lengths of strings (tag names, attributes names/values) and preallocating enough space for ~99% of those, so that's quite useful data to have too |
| 12:10 | <Philip`> | (I suppose data about attribute-value-length per attribute-name could be useful too - src and href and onclick etc are usually really long, but maybe you could easily preallocate space for all the shorter attributes) |
| 12:13 | <annevk> | Philip`, I mentioned this in a pm, but I suppose it can be discussed here as well, how about merging the <canvas> testsuites? It would be great if your testsuite became accessible to more people so they can contribute I think |
| 12:18 | <Philip`> | annevk: That sounds like a good thing to do |
| 12:19 | <annevk> | seems that you cover most, if not everything, of the tests I covered and more so using your stuff as base makes more sense now :) |
| 12:19 | <Philip`> | I can't think of any immediately obvious ways to merge all the existing ones, since mine is weird and puts everything in tiny boxes and tries to avoid ever having humans look at the results |
| 12:20 | <annevk> | it does mark the boxes either red or green which is enough for humans |
| 12:25 | <Philip`> | annevk: I think the problem is more with other tests like http://tc.labs.opera.com/html/canvas/getContext/2d/arc/004.htm and http://hixie.ch/tests/adhoc/html/canvas/005.html whose pass/fail outcome can't really be determined automatically |
| 12:29 | <annevk> | hmm, yeah, I suppose it makes sense that the testsuite consists of an automated part an a non-automated one |
| 12:29 | <Philip`> | (I think I've only got three which can't be done automatically in a perfect browser, plus two that can't be done automatically in Firefox/Opera because of bugs) |
| 12:30 | <Philip`> | ((Bugs related to security of data: and drawImage and getImageData, in particular)) |
| 12:32 | <Philip`> | (But IE/Safari can hardly do any of them automatically, since they lack getImageData or equivalent) |
| 12:34 | <annevk> | it makes some sense to require getImageData for the testsuite... it's a feature of <canvas> after all :) |
| 15:10 | <annevk> | someone suggested that hashchanged shouldn't be past tense to be more in line with other comments |
| 20:01 | <Hixie> | http://www.chewontech.com/2007/08/more-things-added-in-html-5.html is surprisingly well-written |
| 20:15 | <Philip`> | Hixie: Probably because they nicked it from http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/xml/library/x-html5/ |
| 20:16 | <Hixie> | huh |
| 20:16 | <Hixie> | interesting |
| 20:17 | <Hixie> | the style of the chewontech page make it much easier to read than the ibm one |
| 20:17 | <Hixie> | to the point where i read the chewontech page but couldn't read the ibm one |
| 23:13 | <gsnedders> | how many times have I defended IE from people trying to make MS look bad? |
| 23:14 | <othermaciej> | is that a trick qustion? |
| 23:14 | <gsnedders> | othermaciej: a rhetorical one |
| 23:14 | <gsnedders> | complaining filter goes against the option in CSS2.1 of using hyphens or underscore this time, despite it predating CSS2.1 |
| 23:15 | <othermaciej> | I think the CSS vendor prefix convention also predates CSS 2.1 |
| 23:15 | <gsnedders> | othermaciej: I just looked it up. Couldn't find it in CSS2 |
| 23:15 | <othermaciej> | although I don't know if it predates the IE filter property |
| 23:16 | <gsnedders> | IE filter was introduced in IE4 |
| 23:16 | <gsnedders> | (which also predates CSS2) |
| 23:16 | <othermaciej> | the worse thing about filter is that SVG introduced a filter CSS property with an incompatible syntax |
| 23:17 | <othermaciej> | but I blame SVG for that, not Microsoft |
| 23:19 | <gsnedders> | it's often on a forum which I go to less and less, as I've been called an idiot so many times for believing that XHTML isn't the future, and that MS isn't totally shit |
| 23:19 | <othermaciej> | well, IE is really not that great in terms of standards complliance and has not advanced much in a long time |
| 23:20 | <othermaciej> | so I'm not sure all criticism of MS is off-base |
| 23:21 | <gsnedders> | a lot of it is |
| 23:24 | <Hixie> | there are a lot of people who criticise IE unfairly and incorrectly |
| 23:24 | <Hixie> | but there's a lot of criticism that IE could get fairly and accurately that it doesn't |
| 23:24 | <Hixie> | it's possible the two balance out :-) |
| 23:24 | <gsnedders> | also a lot who criticise the devs, cwilso especially |
| 23:24 | <Hixie> | chris is a fine man |
| 23:24 | <Hixie> | not the most active of chairmen, but that's another story |
| 23:25 | <Hixie> | someone give me a random number |
| 23:25 | <gsnedders> | 42 |
| 23:25 | <Hixie> | dom-events it is |
| 23:25 | <gsnedders> | (not really random, but hey) |
| 23:26 | <gsnedders> | in the case of some people in the WG they'll complain if he isn't active as chair, and if he is, they'll complain he isn't improving Trident |
| 23:26 | <Hixie> | he could be more active than he is without really eating into his Trident productivity much |
| 23:26 | <gsnedders> | I know, but they'll find reasons to complain at him someway or another |
| 23:27 | <gsnedders> | I remember one reaction I got around a year ago when I told someone Tantek was lead of IE5/Mac. Then my saying how old IE5/Mac was. They had assumed it was recent, and it was terrible because it was MS. |
| 23:28 | <gsnedders> | Hixie: why did you want a random number, though? |
| 23:29 | <Hixie> | i'm picking things to work on in the spec |
| 23:29 | <gsnedders> | then how do numbers map to things in the spec? |
| 23:29 | <Hixie> | 42 was the 42nd folder on my IMAP server |
| 23:29 | <gsnedders> | ah. |
| 23:29 | <Hixie> | INBOX.input-for-whatwg-dom-events |
| 23:30 | <hendry> | :) |
| 23:30 | <Hixie> | ok |
| 23:30 | <Hixie> | <img alt> |
| 23:30 | <Hixie> | it seems there are three kinds of images |
| 23:30 | <gsnedders> | I wonder if Douglas Adams' ever knew what the consequences of trying to think of what a normal number would be |
| 23:30 | <Hixie> | images that are really just fancy alternatives to actual text |
| 23:31 | <Hixie> | images that are purely decorative |
| 23:31 | <Hixie> | and images that are intrinsic to the content but have no textual alternative |
| 23:32 | hendry | would agree with that |
| 23:32 | <gsnedders> | what about graphs? |
| 23:32 | <hendry> | gsnedders: vector graphics? |
| 23:32 | <gsnedders> | they have vital to the content, but can have a textual alternative |
| 23:32 | <gsnedders> | hendry: no, just images that contain graphs |
| 23:32 | <gsnedders> | anyhow, I must go sleep |
| 23:32 | <Hixie> | examples being a simple diagram or graph that can be described textually, a snapshot from a movie in a movie review or a diagram or graph that just repeats what the prose says, and a photo on flickr respectively |